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Re: DS9 S3: Second Skin

@ILdaf
Jeez, take it down a notch, would you. No reason to get so emotional.
" I never bought for one second that the plot can successfully convice Kira, since we already know it's 'impossible' for Kira to be a Cardassian and not making any sense on so many level."
So... the Obsidian Order knew from the beginning that she wasn't a real spy. They just wanted to mess with her to make her crack. They injected her with god knows what, they made it impossible to escape, they changed her appearance, they made a video, they created a clone. And the most important thing, which Kira knows, the Obsidian Order is capable of creating such a deep cover sleeper agent.
For Kira the question was: Why are they doing this to me? What she didn't know was that she was just a pawn in a game that wasn't really about her.

"Otherwise, this seems even more stupid because basically Cardassian helped the Bajoran to fight themself by giving a trained operative to fight them. See!"
You do understand what a sleeper agent is? She was part of Shaakars resistence group, not the leader of the resistence. I don't know if you lack empathy but the character Kira has seen far more crazy stuff during the occupation than a sleeper agent.

"The point is the show do nothing trying to convince us Kira is really a Cardassian"
They never wanted to really convince her. They just wanted to mess her up enough to make Ghemor act.

"The sudden reversal at the end when Kira shown starting to doubt herself is almost made me throw up"
Jesus man if that almost makes you throw up then I strongly advice against watching several episodes (There is one episode with Sisko....). Everybody cracks at some point. At the end Kira wasn't like: Ok boys, I'm a Cardassian know. What's for dinner?" Again she couldn't flee(desperation), they pumped drugs into her.

" There is nothing apart from those video (which we know on 24th century and sophisticated surgery/make up) could easily be tampered." Well, they had the corpse but that is besides the point. What could they not have fabricated? What kind of proof would you have accepted?

"Heck, if the Pralate had any sense and doing a discreet and independent DNA " Why would he suspect that?? His daughter existed, his daughter was a sleeper agent and as they say sometimes the "awakening" process doesn't work.

"Are you telling you justified coercion to someone proving to be quite useful, not guilty, and giving you an invaluable information. "
Let's not forget that Garak is a murderer, torturer and he was the second highest agent in the most ruthless organisation in the quadrant. If he hadn't lost his position then he would still be mass murdering his way through the alpha quadrant. Without him they couldn't have saved Kira. I guess you would have argued: "No Captain, we cannot coerce this monster. We have to let Kira die on Cardassia! What's for dinner?"

"Moral of the story. No good deed goes unpunished i suppose. "
Garak could humiliate and then kill an old enemy. So he got something...

Re: DS9 S3: Second Skin

I think the episode was about how a combination of desperation and sophisticated methods can distort your sense of self and it did that very well.
And Garak at that point was certainly no prince in shining armor but a ruthless spy completely dependent on the goodwill of his former enemies. Without coercion he wouldn't have lifted a finger for anybody.

Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

@Edward
That guy gets it :D

@Robert
You mean back then when they had 500 subscriber on youtube. ;)
I like the half in the bag stuff better than the plinkett stuff, which was far more shark jumpy than the newer stuff.

Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

And it is like the fiftieth time that somebody has counted correctly on this site...today. :)

Re: DS9 S5: Rapture

@Chrome
" but it's fun to imagine if such a being existed and what stories may stem from it. "
That is all good. I don't haved a problem with using religious imagery but this is not about an actual angel. It is just a person in a suit even though of course that "angel" literally saves the galaxy. I just think that it makes no sense for a human first raised by scientists and then on Vulcan in an atheist society that is part of multi planet federation to look at something and the first thing that comes to mind is angel. Watch the trailer again. The word angel features very prominently in it. Even the word apocalyptic.
Do you think they included that because they thought: Angels and the Apocalypse are very trekkian concepts?

Re: DS9 S5: Rapture

@Jason R.
Sure. 50 years ago being christian was pretty much the norm in many Western countries. The greek gods are used in a few of our oldest stories: Hercules, Odysee, Troj. Without Homer we probably wouldn't know that much about them.
What do you know about the Titans and how they looked? Right. Nothing.
Or Vishnu or the Gandharva. Yeah, nothing.
Is it really that likely that an atheist society, consisting of dozens of species and many more cultures in 300 years would see an anthropomorphic being with wings and think: That looks like one of those helpers of the abrahamic god. What was it called again... yes angel" Burnham wasn't even raised on earth.
It was called red angel because it is an American show for western audiences and it sounds mysterious. In doesn't make much sense in Discovery or Star Trek.

@Chrome
Well, they have a pretty strong link to American culture for around 70 years. I believe that they also had a concept of angels through Buddhism (Tennin).

Re: DS9 S5: Rapture

@ Bobbington Mc Bob
Totally agree. Religion was always the weakest aspect of DS9 (and BSG) but this being an US show and the US being by far the most religious country in the western hemisphere (not counting Italy; in all the other major European countries less than half believe that there is a god) it is probably unavoidable.
In TNG it was portrayed like humanity had left religion and everything that it entails behind but the religious revival in the US of the late 80s and 90s started to undermine this, I guess.
That is why it made no sense to call it "the red angel" in Discovery. That was only made for US audiences. For people in Star Trek saying that would be like us seeing some phenomenon and calling it the "the mighty Ra". Most people in Star Trek wouldn't really know what an angel is (a western/middle eastern concept of a servant of a monotheistic god) or how it looks like. It is so dumb...
In DS9 the religious stuff gets really stupid...
But I don't want to spoil it.