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Bucktown
Mon, Jan 27, 2020, 1:23pm (UTC -6)
Re: ENT S2: The Crossing

So much for "to seek out new life and new civilizations."

I agree with just about everyone here. This episode seems like a perfect encapsulation of the first two seasons of the show in general - a good premise with a lot of promise that is squandered and then turned absolute garbage.

Blowing up the aliens' ship at the end is so antithetical to the Trek ethos. Really embarrassing stuff. I really hate when in more recent interviews Berman & Braga blame Trek fatigue over 17 years for the cancellation of Enterprise. No, I'm sorry. It's episodes like this that turned off and soured the fanbase, who never wanted to bother tuning back in when this was the schlock they were getting.
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Patrick D
Mon, Jan 27, 2020, 10:07am (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

Trek reflects the times. You see a lot more Cold War stories in TOS/TNG than you ever see in Voyager. If the writers want to comment on terrorism and immigration in Trek, they need to set up some conflict in the Trekverse that’s similar. It’s not like Star Wars where it’s all fantasy - Trek by nature is interested in talking about current events through allegory.
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Geekgarious
Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 1:48pm (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

The concept of a canon in a fictional universe serves only to allow corporate entities to say certain stories are more important than others. The concept of canonicity began as a joke, but has become a corporate canard of immense power over the last 20 years, due largely to George Lucas and his endless and endlessly stupid revisionism. Prior to the special additions, hell, prior to the prequels, nobody cared about what was or wasn’t canon. More on the canonicity canard here.

https://www.themarysue.com/star-wars-expanded-universe-canon/
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Keith DeCandido
Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 1:39pm (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

FYI, there's a credit missing from the writer list: Kirsten Beyer, a Trek novelist, who is very much a driving force behind this show, even though she's not as famous as the male names in the writing credits......
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KL
Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 9:13am (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S4: Prey

In retrospect, I am glad we had Janeway in the way she was written. Like all of us, she was flawed: she can be inconsistent, she let her emotion get the better of her, at times she displayed incredible pettiness and vengefulness.... sometimes you’ll hate her. Hence I found her character more interesting and realistic than all the Mary Sue types that inundated TV and movies nowadays.
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Yanks
Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 8:37am (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

@ OmicronThetaDeltaPhi

"@Yanks
"You don't have a choice, it is canon."

Of-course I have a choice. We all do. As intelligent consumers of entertainment, it is up to us to decide what we accept and we don't."

You have a choice to watch and to like or dislike trek, but you do not determine what is and isn't canon. Neither do I.

"Anyway, since nearly everybody here seems to be thrilled with new direction that Trek has taken, I'm not going to ruin your party. Enjoy."

I certainly will.
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KL
Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 8:35am (UTC -6)
Re: TNG S5: The Outcast

Wow. So many SJWs judging this episode with absolutely no context in the time it was made and all
snowflakes over Andy’s Friend comments and observations. The fact that this episode even made it to the screen is a testament of the risk it took. Then again I am not surprised. You Social Justice Warriors routinely rewrite and revise history so you can pretend that you are some sort of social pioneers when it all has been done and accomplished and by better people.
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P'kard
Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 4:12am (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S4: Nemesis

Great twist that I did not see coming what so ever. Also great to see Chakotay in a modern warfare setting.
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Sarjenka's Brother
Sun, Jan 26, 2020, 12:37am (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S2: The 37's

Folks make a lot of good points about the flaws in the story -- especially a truck that remains operational after being in space. That should have been caught in writers' meeting.

And how did they have such nice weather and a blue sky after going through that maelstrom of an atmosphere?

Usually these unforced errors diminish an episode, but I honestly got swept up in the sentiment and emotional impact of the episode.

I think it could have been a good two-parter actually, with Part I being the season ender for season 1.
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Sarjenka's Brother
Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 10:36pm (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S1: Learning Curve

Sometimes I find myself swimming against the "Trek" tide, and this is one of them.

I liked "Learning Curve," and I think Janeway gave Tuvok the assignment because he ALSO had a lot to learn -- and she knew it.

In series placement, I think this would have worked a lot better around episode 5, 6 or 7. I think Maquis integration should have been the first story arc.

It was also not a good episode with which to end a season.

As for the cheese, I actually thought it was an inventive and even plausible explanation for the biopack infection. I'm sure the designers of the ship never anticipated a live galley.

Great outing? Nope. But I think it's better than most folks do.
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Sarjenka's Brother
Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 10:10pm (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S1: Jetrel

I think this was Voyager's "Duet." It even comes in the same place as "Duet" -- next to last episode of the first season.

And just as I'd rate "DS9" higher than "Voyager," I'd rate "Duet" higher than "Jetrel." Still, it was a very good hour of "Trek" and one of the best episodes of season 1.

Among its other attributes, it definitely fleshes out the character of Neelix, who needed it pretty badly.

One nit-pick: I would have liked to haven known the current status of Talax. Is it still conquered and ruled by Jetrel's race or did it break free? Either, I'm surprised Voyager could just assume orbit around the moon of a planet with a space-faring race in control and not have to explain itself.
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Kevin Cutshall
Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 6:54pm (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S2: Twisted

This episode was average to me. It's hard to fathom though, how the ship being stretched and twisted led to rooms not being where they should be. It seemed more like a rearranging than a stretching.

BTW, They use the pool hall too much. That's two episodes in a row.
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eekl
Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 12:04pm (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

One critical question to Jammer: why haven't you reviewed Star Trek: The Animated Series?
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Sarjenka's Brother
Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 10:55am (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S1: Faces

Four stars for Roxanne as the split selves.

Three stars for the rest of the episode. Very solid but with some flaws as others pointed out.

So 3.3333 stars from me. And I concur with Caz's comments above about the Vidiians. "Voyager" didn't break much new ground, but the Vidiians were a different kind of beast. We should have had a few more episodes with them.
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Sarjenka's Brother
Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 10:44am (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S1: Cathexis

Just good enough to not be memorably bad "Trek." Among other things, it committed the sin of being kind of boring.

And I'm more easily entertained that most.
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skye maidstone
Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 8:58am (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

Thoroughly enjoyed it. Vastly superior to DSC (which i'll probably watch S3 of anyway just because...)

Daj/Isa Briones initially seems a far superior actor to pretty much any of the DSC main characters (except maybe Saru and i'm not including Pike since he's not really a main) - although that's a little harsh on the actors since they're given pretty much nothing to do except spout technobabble or stare at greenscreen/cgi.

Comparisons asides this almost had the cosy feeling TNG had in a lot of way to me but with a slightly darker edge (DS9) style without being delierately gritty.

I haven't been smashed hard in the face with a diversity spade yet, if it was there then good, it should be natural and ridiculously forced as in some Netflix shows.

Very promising start. 3.5 out of 4 for me. Not 4 due to a couple of jarring moments. Like someone else commented.. It seems little silly that romulans assassins can beam in and our with weapons around a major Star Fleet facility and nothing is on the security feeds or records. Daj exploded without leveling a molecule around to analyse - this may be explained later though however: Section 31 cover-up etc.

Hard to rate these really since they're not longer really serialised like TNG. I was dumbly expecting the whole series to drop on the 24th for some reason. I should pay more attention.

Always nice to see more good sci-fi about anyway. Still a little thin on the ground (I devoured The Expanse too fast).
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Dick
Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 10:23pm (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

My initial thoughts:

- Everything looked and sounded very nice, especially at Chateau Picard. The camerawork was restrained and the pacing was less frenetic than STD, which is a step in the right direction.

- Sir Patrick Stewart was great, as usual, but I'm not sold on the actress who plays Dahj/Soji. Her over-the-top emoting in some scenes felt very Burnham-esque.

- I won't indulge in too much nitpicking surrounding the increasingly convoluted taxonomy of Soong-type androids (whatever happened to Juliana Tainer?), but the technobabble explaining Dahj's creation was laughably nonsensical. The technical details behind Data's creation were always kept fairly vague on TNG, and they shouldn't have tried anything more ambitious here. Just say that Bruce Maddox created androids using Data's specs and leave it at that.

- As with STD, producing Trek-like dialogue continues to be an issue for the writers of nuTrek. The news interview/exposition dump at the the beginning of the episode was particularly bad in this regard.

- I am intrigued by the teased return of Dr. Bruce Maddox. If he does come back, I hope he gets the same rich characterization as in "The Measure of a Man" and isn't just an evil/insane villain.

Overall, I give Rememberance a tentative 6/10. A lot will depend on how well the plot threads are resolved as the season progresses.
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Batfunk
Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 3:18pm (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

Well, I have mixed feelings about this first episode.
The first 30 MN are nearly perfect. The first scene is a perfect transition with last Tng episode.
The ordinary living of an retired Picard is well retranscribed:he's very old, bored and out of place. His dog named Number one, among other things, is an evidence of his nostalgia and melancholy.
The media interview is a smart way to introduce current political contest and Picard's dogma:10 years ago, Romulus was no more. Picard organized refugees evacuation and a act of terrorism committed by rogue androids cause Federation withdraw of rescue operation and deactivation of all androids.
In protest, Picard resigned.
Even I would have preferred that this show had no link with Kelvin time-line, the context is credible and typical of good Science fiction:this identity withdrawal of Federation echoes our real world and Picard will probably fight this, opposite to real values of Federation.
A moment, I hoped that the show will dig deeper (one more episode) in Picard's melancholic mind and bored life.
Direction was smooth and quiet, dialogues were great and funny until, Bam! ... The ninja scene. Boy, what a shame.
Wasn't there an other way to introduce Dahj character? Jason Bourne style? Come on...
On the contrary, the way to reveal her real identity is fine. Reference to dreams and later to Data's paintings were well made, because it makes use of Trekkies memories. A Really nice touch.
Once again, I hoped the show will explore further in Picard's paternal desires and Bang!, Ninjas are back again(dressed like Dead Space Hero) and Dahj died...
10 MN, faster than a blind date. Shame!
After that, the show was on Discovery mode:Picard, not very moved by Dahj's death, learns in Daystrom Institute that she has... A twin! (drumrolls) and revealed that ninjas were... Romulans! (jawdrop).
And of course, the shocking last shot: the Romulan recovery barge is a... Borg cube!!! (My. GOD.)
Next:an intergalactic conspiracy, with probably a "back from the Dead "Lore manipulating outraged Romulan. Or not.
Well, this episode reminds me a lot Discovery Pilot, which was very respectful of Star Trek ideals, except that here it lasted only 30 MN...
A schizophrenic episode and I hope that producers realized that Patrick Stewart is nearly 80 years old, a bit old to act in an action show(Shatner stopped ST at 64...).
Damn,the beginning was so good...

3 stars
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Yanks
Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 1:35pm (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

Lee,

Neoconservatives typically advocate the promotion of democracy and American national interest in international affairs, including peace through strength (by means of military force), and are known for espousing disdain for communism and for political radicalism.

Not sure what you are referring to.

As to the servants, BZ's comment is apt in that from what we know of the Romulans, they wouldn't be welcome on Earth. Probably refugees.

@ Chrome

"Because they're Romulans. The Klingons did the same thing in TUC when Praxis exploded, remember?"

Sure, I remember. Yes, the Klingons would never ask for help, but I not so sure the xenophobic Romulan's wouldn't call for help in a situation like this. I think they did ask for help, and Spock answered by trying to help them?
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The Chronek
Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 12:32pm (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

Absolutely loved the premiere. Plenty of tidbits to reward longtime fans, but plenty of new stuff to keep the story moving forward. Picard is indeed the captain I remember.

I loved the effects, too. I also enjoyed seeing the characters interact with computers and databases. It felt like the producers took special care to make it look more futuristic, but to still make it feel like a logical evolution from the LCARS displays we saw in 24th-century era Trek.

I'm curious about what's being kept as canon and what's not. For a while, I thought the Countdown comics that preceded the 2009 film were canon. Orci stated that they were canon, and Kurtzman did co-write those comics. But I know, as a rule, only the broadcast shows and films are considered canon.
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Yanks
Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 12:16pm (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

Chrome

"So, can we wager on future events? It seems pretty obvious, given the Romulan infatuation with technology and Machiavellian gambits, that the synthetics who started the Mars incident were Romulan-instigated."

I don't know that I agree here.

I'm thinking that maybe Maddox got a little over-zealous, which is consistent with him in MoM, and causes this whole thing? Why would the Romulans instigate this when they needed the Picard led evacuation effort?

It will be fun to find out though.
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Yanks
Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 12:11pm (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

@ MidshipmanNorris

"I'm gonna say this right up front and without apology: DSC and PIC are two of the LOUDEST shows I've ever watched. I CAN'T HEAR THE DIALOGUE!! Why does the music/sfx have to be so OBSCENELY LOUD?!?!?"

I should have mentioned this. I had the same issue. Very frustrating. The only way I got around it was my sound bar has a button that accentuates conversation. Primarily used for news and documentaries, etc. It worked for me, I'd be interested to hear other solutions.

"At the end of "The Offspring," Data said he uploaded Lal's experience memories into his positronic brain. I'm not sure what this means, but... It seems quite significant."

Could be. This could be where Maddox got info for a pair of Data daughters?

@ OmicronThetaDeltaPhi

"Am I the only person here who is bothered by the fact that the Trekverse has been turned into some kind dystopia? It seems that the same people who had this exact same problem with Discovery, suddenly accept it now without any problem."

Because it's not a dystopian future. Shit happens, even in a Utopian future (which trek NEVER was, Earth was the only utopia). In this case, androids went bats...t and caused some major deaths (900,000?) and there ARE social/institutional and governmental consequences! I like some realism over patty cake pie in the sky plot lines.

"Do you realize what this means for TNG, if we accept any of this as canon? What it means for the inspiring message behind many TNG episodes, to "know" that in 20 years the federation is going to look like this?"

You don't have a choice, it is canon. ... and this will mean nothing to TNG. The inspiring message will come as a result of Picard's effort throughout the series I'm sure.

What does the "federation look like"? Romulus is gone, Mars is ablaze... but what else is messed up?

"It may be good TV, but it's depressing as f***."

I have confidence in Jean-Luc Picard to fix this.

@ Norvo

"Yes, it's a dream sequence so anything goes: but Data never wore that First Contact era uniform on the Enterprise-D (and Picard never drank tea with milk and sugar either)."

Wow, wow, wow... trekkies' innate ability for detail amazes me. :-)

"The Bruce Maddox reference. I wonder if we get to see Brian Brophy reprise his role, IMDB doesn't list Picard among his credits (in fact, he hasn't been in anything since 2014)."

I couldn't open this at work, but Heavy.com thinks he's coming back.

heavy.com/entertainment/2020/01/star-trek-picard-spoilers-bruce-maddox-coming-back/

"If All Good Things... is still canon, there's a chance Picard is suffering from the Alzheimer like Irumodic syndrome. One wonders if this will come to play before the season is through."

True enough. I hope they don't gloss over this. Unless that future didn't really happen because Picard figured the puzzle out in AGT's?

Oh, one more.... I got a chuckle out of "Tea, Earl Grey, decaff" ... especially Picard's tone while saying "decaff".
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Pokeroo
Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 10:08am (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

@OmicronThetaDeltaPhi

If your depressed, don't think of it as "Star Trek". Think of it as a space adventure.

For me, the Trek started with Farpoint and ended when Voyager got home. The rest is "based on Trek", but not the actual trek.
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Pokeroo
Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 7:17am (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

To me the Romulans didn't look like Romulans.

I found out on the internet that the Penny Dreadful guy and the two people in France were meant to be Romulan.

On re-watch, I will keep that in mind.

Other then that, it seems like a good show - not great - just "good" and a decent way to spend time killing.
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Yanks
Fri, Jan 24, 2020, 6:52am (UTC -6)
Re: PIC S1: Remembrance

@ John Harmon

"I was really worried about Picard and I’m glad I was wrong."

Well, he's not Picard from 20 years ago, but I'm fine with the 80 year old version.

"Shockingly not everything in the trailer ended up in the first episode which I really thought would happen."

I'm not sure I like this. I think I would have rather had the trailer just reveal 'Remembrance' stuff and left us guessing for what's to come. I don't think they needed Jerry Ryan to sell this thing, or Riker. Kind of made the big reveal of the Borg Cube kind of blah.

"I’m sad that B-4 didn’t make it. I loved that aspect of the Countdown comic, that the memory transfer worked."

I'm not sad at all. B4 shouldn't have been able to handle "Data". If it could, why create Data in the first place? I'm not familiar with the Countdown Comic, but if was revealed by Dr. Agnes Jurati here that B-4 couldn't handle it.

"I’m confused as to how Picard’s rescue attempt on the Romulans was connected to the “rogue synthetics” destroying the Mars shipyard. That journalist was basically blaming him for it."

Me too... clarity forthcoming I hope.

"I’m also confused how Starfleet had a slave race of androids anyway. Wasn’t that the point of Measure Of A Man? I guess they weren’t sentient?"

MoM dodged the sentient thing all together. Data was only awarded the right to choose, not sentience.


@Rahul

"One part of the history I found dubious is the Romulan supernova and the Romulans reaching out to the Federation for help as if it was an emergency and they didn't see it coming. If anything, the Romulans are extremely good strategists and should have been able to predict their sun going supernova with plenty of time for evacuation/relocation."

I've thought this since ST2009. The whole scenario make no scientific sense what-so-ever.


@ Nolan

"I will say, that while I like DS9 for it's serialization, I don't know if Trek works as a fully serialized series. On-going plot threads, myth arcs, and some multiple episode plot arcs have shown to be really successful, in fact, DS9 and to an extent ENT showed how to do story arcs in Trek successfully, because in those there was overarcing stories and themes, but each episode maintained it's own identity and focus, whilst contributing to the bigger story, even if it was a one-off because it allowed for some pacing. I don't mind heavy serialization, but I'm starting to miss the semi-serial/episodic format. That's where Trek lives at its best I think."

I agree. While DSC appears to be stuck in the season long story arcs, I'm hoping for some sort of episodic format here, but I'm afraid I'm not going to get it. Modern TV seems to be serial... especially with the shortened seasons.


@ Tranya and Tonic

"Nice Disco tie-in with the boyfriend being a Xahean, like Tilly's friend Po."

Wow, nice catch. I completely missed that one.


I have no issue with Soji and her sister. Looking forward to learning how they made them. Having some sort of "Data" around for Picard will pay off I'm sure.

Something I forgot to post last night.... I smell Lore here... but knowing that Spiner was dead set against reviving Data I could be wrong.

Nice to see some new activity here.

Break...

Anyone know when DSC Season 3 will be available?
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