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Scott Gordon
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 6:16am (UTC -5)
Re: ORV S2: Tomorrow, and Tomorrow, and Tomorrow

I was worried about young Kelly's rejection at first, but then I remembered that we were told only that he called her at 9:00 AM the next day. It was also implied that this was not an appropriate time to call and was probably a little off putting to most people. So, since Kelly's memory was wiped (Dr. Finn usually knows what she is doing), I convinced my self that in the original timeline, young Kelly probably react by saying that she didn't see it working out, Ed Mercer is very strong willed and probably got her to come around after the initial reaction. Oh well, at least I was able to satisfy myself with this, but I am not very hard to convince.
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Alan Roi
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 6:10am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

@Booming

"Georgiou laughing about Lecon slowly disintegrating. Georgiou highlights the problem that shows or movies who make everything dark often have. You start to like the bad guys/gals because they are the only ones who have fun."

Its not really a big problem. All you need to do is watch Blakes Seven to see that characters like Avon and Villa who aren't 'good guys' can work just as well as their far more more moral counterparts Blake and Jenna or Cally
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SC
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 6:10am (UTC -5)
Re: ORV S2: Sanctuary

The last two episodes have earned a 3.5 from Jammer! I know it's like comparing apples and oranges, but in comparison, Discovery has received 2/4.

Yet, The Orville hasn't been renewed yet.
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Booming
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 5:59am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

What can I say... (You can reread Karl Zimmermanns review, that is more less what I think) A few things I would like to add.

Last things first. They have probably no real idea where to go from here. That could be why we didn't see any footage from future Discovery which surprised me because I thought we would get at least a short glimpse of where this is going.

About the actual episode. Pardon my french but Discovery is just balls to the walls crazy. The Enterprise is apparently a giant fleet carrier but Lecon was prepared and brought his/her/its own mini ships. Psych!

Then it is mostly battle of the five armies. Looks good but mostly CGI extravaganza that doesn't really do anything on an emotional level. I laughed quite a bit about all the craziness. I actually laughed a lot during this episode.
I mean who puts the emergency lever for a blast door on the side of the door that is facing the hull.
The very same engineer probably thought: Ok, emergency lever on the wrong side. The only thing this blast door now needs is a window!" Hahahahaha so crazy!

Three times I laughed about actual jokes.
- When Reno shouted out of the closing elevator. It was more a chuckle but I thought: Oh, she remembered that her character needs more than one dimension.
- Saru: "You learned to fly a ship." Maybe it was the delivery but I laughed hard and long about that.
- Georgiou laughing about Lecon slowly disintegrating. Georgiou highlights the problem that shows or movies who make everything dark often have. You start to like the bad guys/gals because they are the only ones who have fun.

cringe moment:
"Yum Yum" I will say no more.

I would have preferred it if they had played it straight with Tilly at least in this episode. Jumping from her being traumatized back to making quips again. Eh.. it wasn't terrible but it kind of lessened the effect her being devastated by Stamets injury had.

Call me a sucker but I liked the Culber/Stamets stuff. We also saw that if we know somebody (Stamets) and this person gets injured then that can actually have an impact. I knew that he wouldn't die but still. #nomoredeadgays

Oh and when Michael and Spock were talking at the end of the epsiode I just thought: Really, we are having a personal moment NOW?!

Thankfully it wasn't the horrible mess that the season 1 ending was.
I'm giving my only real star rating this season
3 Stars


PS: Apart from the queen not joining I knew everything that would happen far before it happened on the show and I'm not sure if this is a good or a bad thing.
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Daya
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 5:58am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

Hello. I don't think Control/Leland died completely. He was in the spore cage. I think there's a reason for that. I think a few nanites figured out how to jump into the spore world from here. There they will slowly build technology and multiply, and in fifty years build the first Unicomplex in spore world ("transwarp hub"). Then they will jump out and start taking over the real world again as the Borg.

Did the writers get scared to say all of this explicitly? May be they left out making this explicit, so as not to offend any one. But the similarities of Control to the Borg, Leland's death in the spore cage, Tilly/Culber's sojourns to the spore world and back, the spore world's transwarp capabilities, "struggle is pointless", poking the eye with nanites, hunger to assimilate, all indicate that this was clearly intended throughout their writing.
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axiom
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 5:58am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

@OmicronThetaDeltaPhi

Yes, really. Exuding toxic energy -- using profanity, excessive insults, and articulating double standards towards hero characters (who happen to be women and POC) -- is not the foundation of constructive debate. Nor, I would argue, does it enable us to go out and give our best in a world of difference. You can't start building bridges when your critique is laced with coded, incendinary rhetoric. You may not see that, but others do. I'm not tone tone policing -- post away! -- but I will name it.

Whether or not folks link this kind of behavior to bigger social bads is their perogative. But I remind you that the latter do not solely exist "out there" -- they are reproduced through everyday micro-practices, in sublte ways. In any case, I really question the value that kind of discourse brings to this discussion, or to our lives. Feel free to disagree, but I do hope this makes my position clearer.
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Springy
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 5:39am (UTC -5)
Re: TOS S2: The Changeling

Standard issue fare for TOS, hitting all the notes except "starry-eyed sexy lady falling for Kirk." Instead, it is an eyeless, floating piece of metal which falls for Kirk.

The Uhura thing was beyond silly, though it was nice to see her get some screen time.

A good sci fi concept, not particularly well played out. Average.
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Dom
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 5:27am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

@Baron Samedi, "I've chided Enterprise a fair amount in the past, but in Season 3, the writers knew better than to link the Xindi weapon storyline with some intimate secret from Archer's past. I feel like the Discovery writers would have made the head Xindi scientist Archer's long-lost alien stepfather and intertwined scenes of Archer dealing with childhood trauma with the Enterprise's efforts to stop Earth from being destroyed, and that would obviously have been insufferable."

That pretty much sums it up. Good writers will find some way to tie a character's arc with the central threat or MacGuffin of the plot. The most interesting part of Enterprise Season 3 was how the Xindi threat led Archer to abandon his principles, albeit briefly. He it just been a story about defeating a super weapon, it would have been even less effective. Making tying the threat to the character by making them related through blood is often just a lazy attempt to imbue it with emotional baggage rather than actually giving the character a real arc.
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MadManMUC
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 5:23am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

@OmicronThetaDeltaPhi

'Hint: Not liking what the DSC writers are doing with the Burnham character does not automatically make a person misogynist (or racist).'

Correct.

I don't care about which gender or ethnicity the lead character is, or how many women v men or straight people v gay people or white v black people there are on the cast. This is a complete non-issue for me.

What I do care about, however, is how credible or likable or believable or well-developed a character is. And MB is neither credible, nor believable, nor particularly likable.
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OmicronThetaDeltaPhi
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 5:16am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

@Axiom

"Yet there are a really unnerving number of voices which echo misogynist, reactionary claims week after week."

Really?

Can you name even one commenter who posts "misogynist reactionary claims" on a weekly basis?

Sure, occasionally we get such comments here as well. But they are (thankfully) few and far between. So what the **** are you on about?

Hint: Not liking what the DSC writers are doing with the Burnham character does not automatically make a person misogynist (or racist).

As for your final paragraph: I agree. Let's go out there and fix the world... or at least, our tiny personal corner of it. It can be as simple as making a single person from our immediate surroundings happier. Or perhaps, as simple as stopping before we decide to accuse people of being misogynist just because they don't like a given character on a TV show.

And after we've done our part to help humanity, there's nothing to stop us from sitting back at our keyboards and discussing Star Trek. The two things are not mutually exclusive, you know.
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wolfstar
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 5:14am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

Weirdest reset button I've ever seen in a show. I'm going for 2.5 stars because it was well-made, but... no.

Control is neutralized just by killing Leland. When Georgiou kills him, all the drones/ships operated by Control go dead in the water. Why would the Control AI transfer its entire self into a single vulnerable body? Until now, the impression was always that it was merely using Leland as something like an avatar. There was never any suggestion that just killing Leland would defeat Control. If that's the case (which apparently it was), why wasn't the plan to kill Leland (thereby neutralising Control) rather than to jump to the future?

I thought it was ridiculous that they were frantically piecing together the time suit at the last minute in this episode when they spent the whole of the previous episode making extended goodbyes and standing around talking, all the while knowing the S31 fleet was on its way.

The only reason Burnham knows where to send the signals from... is because she did it in the first place. How does original Burnham in any timeline learn why she needs to send the signals from those points?

How does Burnham make the bursts? OK, so they built her a "time suit" containing a time crystal. How does it generate or release a signal?

Burnham has never worn this suit before. How does she fly it through space? It has no visible means of propulsion, yet she's able to fly it perfectly through space like Iron Man as if she's been wearing it all her life. (At least Iron Man was shown struggling to master his suit when he first built it... I haven't seen the film in a decade but I seem to recall that being the case.)

The scene where Burnham cries as Spock tells her that she basically made him who he is and that he's her "balance" and "always has been", to the extent he doesn't know if he'll be able to cope without her, is a reach.

Saru's sister is a fighter pilot now, and so are all the other Kelpiens, in Ba'ul ships? This is a very sudden and arbitrary development. What on earth went down on Kaminar between The Sound Of Thunder and this episode - did the Kelpiens attack the Ba'ul and steal the ships? Did they come to some kind of peaceful agreement with the Ba'ul and borrow the ships? Once again, Saronna is the only Kelpien we see or who has a speaking role. I know the Kelpiens went through the Vaharai, which makes them more assertive and less fearful, but having an agrarian pastoral race turn into fighter pilots without any dialog or screen time being devoted to this development is asking a lot.

Tyler is staying behind so he can operate in the "grey areas" as part of Section 31 and keep the organization on track, but wait, now he's by L'Rell's side on the Klingon flagship shouting instructions to the fleet in Klingon... but wait, now he's back on Earth and Starfleet are putting him in charge of Section 31 based on... what, exactly? If Section 31 was a large organization in this time period and had all those ships, presumably all with their own captains and command crew, surely they must have other more experienced operatives than Tyler, even if Control killed a lot of people in the organization... it's like "well, Leland is dead and Georgiou is gone, so as you're the only other Section 31 character we've seen and who has a speaking role, congratulations!"

What about Leland's characterization? He was another interesting "grey area" character in the first half of the season, who could have been developed and used in a smart way, but he became Lorca 2.0 and his characterisation went out of the window as soon as his function as a plot device became apparent. The one saving grace in this is that they didn't go down the Borg route, despite the nanoprobe injections and "struggle is pointless".

So Leland is killed and "Control has been neutralized" before Discovery goes through the wormhole. Why does it still need to go to the future?

I think Ethan Peck's performance is the single thing I'm most thankful for in this season arc as a whole. It was a risky role to step into but he was masterful. I liked the Enterprise send-off with Pike, Spock and Number One. But it was weird to end the episode there, given that this show is Discovery and it's the Discovery characters who we've spent 2 seasons with and are supposed to care about. Ending the show with the Enterprise's send-off while never even showing us where Discovery ended up felt off... the send-off was great but I thought we'd cut back to Discovery one more time on the other side of the wormhole. I guess they wanted to show as little as possible because they haven't decided what they're going to do next season.

Screwing things up so badly that you have to create a loophole that excises everything you've spent the past two seasons doing from the show's canon and worldbuilding, by removing the ship and its crew from the timeline and forbidding the remaining characters from ever speaking about it, is not good writing. The journey has not been worth it.

What was this season about? What were its themes, its ideas? Any themes it did touch on - the dangers of AI, predestination, the syncretic religion in New Eden - were barely developed, and addressed (if at all) so superficially as to be barely there.

The more I think about it, the more 2.5 stars seems kind.
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SlackerInc
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 5:05am (UTC -5)
Re: ORV S2: Tomorrow, and Tomorrow, and Tomorrow

That was great! Might be my favorite episode of the series to date.

What a twist at the end. I guess she was wrong and she's actually creating divergent timelines (which is the only way time travel makes sense IMO).
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axiom
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 4:56am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

PS -- I mean, seriously, folks. "Fucking miserable." "Devoid." Dog whistle rhetoric.

I value constructive debate about art, but we are not going anywhere with this kind of rhetoric. If you don't "give a microscopic shit," please spare us. The only "galling" thing is to find ourselves in a world where a shared passion elicits this kind of discourse.
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axiom
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 4:51am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

As usual, I thought this was a more or less effective ride. There are less than credible moments, and there are very effective ones (Stamets and Culber, for example). I'm satisfied with the resolution, and keen to see what the far future holds -- now we really get to discover. I'd give the season *** on the whole. SSS P1 would be a **.5, and P2 would be a ***.5.

And, right on time, here we have all the usual critics repeating the same gripes. At times, the commentary here is truly insightful (critical and intelligent). Yet there are a really unnerving number of voices which echo misogynist, reactionary claims week after week. Do these folks see what they're saying?

There are real and troubling problems in the world. Why not embrace the spirit of Trek, turn off the TV, and dive head in with a constructive and progressive outlook?
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OmicronThetaDeltaPhi
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 4:43am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

@Daya
"Is it possible that young Jim Kirk is a bridge officer on the Enterprise?"

Not likely. We know that Kirk was stationed on the USS Farragut around that time (2255)

But if you really want him to be on the Enterprise, you could argue that he was assigned there temporarily for some reason. Besides, if you care about leaving the TOS timeline intact, you would have far bigger problems to worry about...
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MadManMUC
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 4:42am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

I know you're a troll, Alan Roi, and I really should feed you, but I just want to state now, for the record: Your opinions don't interest me in the slightest. So, don't bother.

You're patronising. You personally attack other users. You derail discussions.

This is the final time I'm engaging you.
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Alan Roi
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 4:38am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

@MadManMUC

..."Saint Michael Fucking Burnham"...

This is the best reason I can see that CBS needs to stop making any furhter attempts to offer any deference to thr detractors of their efforts.
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Bobby
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 4:30am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

I enjoyed it, and now we know why the spore drive is never mentioned.

Is it possible the show is going to change focus to Enterprise? Surely not, but I wouldn't complain. Pike is awesome, that actor nails it.
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CanOfUbik
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 4:24am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

So Discovery opted for the Armin-Tamzarian-Solution to solve its many canon problems... Not very convincing, but about the level of sublety I've come to expect from it.

The episode itself was pretty much a reflection of DSC as a whole: Good, sometimes outstanding production values and visuals barely covering a mess of unearned melodramatic moments, plot holes and forced action sequences.

The ending tasted very much like house cleaning, leaving the producers with all options for season 3: Continue with Discovery in the future in any shape and style they want, go on an nostalgia cruise with Pike-Enterprise or just call it a series finale and cancel Discovery. Fits pretty well with The Gorn's comments above about potential reshuffling behind the scenes.
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MadManMUC
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 4:11am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

All flash, no substance. None. Zero. Utterly devoid.

Space battles. Hyper-fast panning shots. Melodrama. More space battles. More hyper-fast panning shots. More melodrama.

I wish I could even say that I'm disappointed or surprised, but I'm actually neither of those things. This show set the bar so low, I would have actually been shocked if they'd delivered something other than what they did with this.

It was utter, utter nonsense.

It does kind of feel like we actually saw the series finale, though, like Eric said.

And, if that's the case, it's for the best. They really made a dog's dinner of this series. S01 was just fucking miserable, and S02 was too inconsistent. Oh, sure, there were some semi-watchable episodes, and they even came a bit close to making this show feel like actual Trek once or twice, and Anson Mount was just stellar in the role. But, these things can only be really appreciated in isolation from the premise of both show and season.

It's weird. With other Trek series (ENT notwithstanding, I still hate that thing), I generally view them as being basically good series with a few shit episodes. Discovery, for me is the reverse: a turd of a series that — once or twice — sort of has something decent happening in S02.

What galls me the most is that the very basic premise of the season — seven mysterious red signals scattered all over the galaxy — was an utterly wasted opportunity. Instead of making the signals manifestations of Saint Michael Fucking Burnham, they could have made them about anything else: a new alien race with a first contact opportunity, a new stellar phenomenon, something. Anything other than trying to show us how — once again — great and awesome the mutinous war-starter is. There was a bucket-load of Star Trek and literal discovery waiting to be leveraged in the basic premise, but no: instead we got ... this.

Yeah, well, it is what it is. Not good Trek, not even good science fiction, awful plotting and dialogue, and characters I couldn't give even the most microscopic shit about.

At least I have The Expanse S04 to look forward to this year (well, hopefully this year).
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Daya
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 4:11am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

I liked it. The ending on the Enterprise was great with all the bridge sounds, Spock finally taking his seat, and Alexander Courage's music in the end caused me to really believe they will be going on the five year mission soon.

This is the last Spock / Pike will ever see of Discovery, and somehow I want to stay in Spock's timeline and bid them a final goodbye as I see them blazing a trail of glory into the future. I am glad the episode chose this strange point of view for the ending.

= = = =

"Mr. Spock to the bridge." That's Kirk. Captain James T. Kirk. I just can't reconcile that voice with Pike. They used Shatner's recording. I'm sure of it. Is it possible that young Jim Kirk is a bridge officer on the Enterprise? Anyway they were pretty much all breaking the fourth wall in that final scene so we don't have to take it so seriously.

Also, the Enterprise warped away almost like it used to in the TOS title sequence. No warp flattening, just high speed. Also, they did the "the Cage" opening shot in reverse at the end. All cool.
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AR
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 4:04am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

I need to digest this for a while; watching it live, all I could think, over and over, was "yeah, sure, OK". My gut reaction was this was a lot of convoluted nonsense. Pretty nonsense, but sheesh.

Control knocked out every other shuttle and drone protecting Burnham, then she and Spock land and just chill out and finish the mission with only one stray shot coming their way? OK.

Really was kind of that hull breach to only kill the no-name extras during that not-nearly-cool-or-deadly-enough fight in the corridors.

So Tyler somehow managed fetch the Klingons and come back that quickly (also, C-A-V-A-L-R-Y, damnit!)? OK

So just lure Leland into the spore chamber (which it totally looked like it should've been able to break out of) and turn on the magnets? That's all it took to kill it? OK.

The manual release for the blast door was right by the door, but she couldn't rig a way to pull it from the other side? Roll under the door? (Did they explain why they couldn't just site-to-site beam her out of the room?) Also, after the battle, the saucer section of the Enterprise looked like &!#@ing Unicron took a bite out of it, but Pike survived behind a simple blast door at point blank range? It didn't, I dunno, blow out the entire deck around him and jettison his turbolift into space (after what looked like a ton of turbolifts being picked off by explosions and debris earlier)? OK.

So this entire arc was just a closed timey wimey loop of Michael being led by signals from herself in the future? OK.

So that's it? Just pretend Discovery was destroyed, all wrapped up in a neat bow? OK.

Also, there's a reason "Number One" doesn't seem to have an actual name, besides a running gag, right?

Again, I need to think about it. Viscerally I wasn't bored, but mentally I was annoyed.

So. I guess it was better than season one? Once again no true stinkers (easier when there's only 14 eps and things are so heavily serialized), also plenty of meh, but I'll take "If Memory Serves", "An Obol for Charon", and "The Sound of Thunder" over anything S1 served up. No earthly idea where S3 could possibly go from here, but for the love of god, no more time travel, and no more "the fate of the entire galaxy is at stake!!!!11!" stories.
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Tim C
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 4:00am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

2.5 stars. It's the opposite of the first season finale`, which was insanely rushed; this was too padded and felt a bit flaccid. When we started getting "2001: A Clip Show Odyssey" in the middle of our Ultimate Space Battle To The Death, I was actively irritated. I've been watching all year, show; I don't need to go on a greatest hits tour. (That said, the trippy visuals were awesome.)

Additionally, the entire subplot with the torpedo and Admiral Cornwell felt completely unnecessary and could have been deleted entirely with no loss to the episode. And I don't buy the denouement, where it's revealed the reason we never hear of the spore drive again is because Starfleet are keeping it hush hush: it makes no sense at all for them to abandon such incredible technology, especially when it had nothing to do with the threat from Control in the first place!

I was also confused by the logistics of the space battle, which is a consequence of filling the screen with a billion fighters, I think. This episode could have been greatly improved with some more restraint, but I think we've learned that's not a word this show is familiar with, for better AND worse.

There was plenty of good on display here though. The opening minutes with the frantic rush to assemble the suit under a ticking clock were excellent, and appropriately heart-pounding. All the performances were on point, as usual, and the battle certainly looked fantastic, if not particularly logically depicted.

Season 2 as a whole? 2.5 stars also. It's probably not going to be the majority opinion, but I think that season 1 was a more ambitious and memorable story, for all its flaws, and it also had the virtue of novelty, being the first new TV Trek in over a decade. Season 1's central mysteries were built around characters, whereas Season 2 gave us a more traditional sci-fi conundrum, and felt more ho-hum as a result. I was far more invested in learning more about Captain Lorca than I ever was in how they were going to technobabble their way out of a fight against Star Trek's version of the Terminator, a story whose facets we've seen in many prior episodes, from all those TOS "AI gone wrong" plots, to the Borg, to ENT's Temporal Cold War.

On an individual level, season 2's episodes were of a higher quality, I think: "Brother", "An Obol for Charon", "If Memory Serves", "The Sound of Thunder" and "Project Daedalus" were all standouts, and the mid-tier stuff like "New Eden", "Light and Shadows" and "Saints of Imperfection" were also quite enjoyable in spite of their flaws. But taken as a whole, it's a bit more of a damp squib.

All of that said, I'm very keen to see what they're cooking up for season 3. I'll see you all here at the end of the year for the Picard show, nerds!

P.S. There's a commenter here named Brandon Adams who owes $10 to the World Wildlife Fund. I won our bet! No Borgs to be found here. ;)
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OmicronThetaDeltaPhi
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 3:29am (UTC -5)
Re: ORV S2: Tomorrow, and Tomorrow, and Tomorrow

Finally seen it. That ending was completely unexpected. Wireless Telephone Facility indeed.

@Dave in MN

"Does that mean next week's episode is in an alternate reality?!"

Obviously. It's right there in the title: 'The Road Not Taken'.

Which leaves us with two huge questions, both of which will be answered next week:

1. The show runners promised us a second two parter in this season after "Identity". Is it S2E13/S2E14 (even though the episodes have different names) or S2E14/S3E01 (which means ending the season with a cliff hanger)?
2. What are the galaxy-shattering ramifications of Kelly never marrying Ed?

Yes, there *should* be galaxy-shattering ramifications. Without the divorce, there's no career slump for Ed. No Kelly begging the admirals to give Ed a second chance. No assignment of Ed to the Orville. No Kelly specifically asking for a position on the Orville. Since Ed brought Gordon aboard, Malloy won't be there either.

No Malloy, no "hugging the donkey" in the pilot, and the Orville probably gets destroyed near Epsilon II by the Krill. The situation with the Moclans and the Kaylons would be very different as well.

(I just hope the guys who write the next episode are aware of all this)
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John Harmon
Fri, Apr 19, 2019, 3:24am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S2: Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2

These are basically all the thoughts I had while watching the episode. Don’t blame anyone not wanting to read all of this, or just wanting to skim, but I figure it’s best to put everything in one comment rather than spam a bunch.

Well I’ll start with the good. It was cool seeing Starfleet HQ. Future San Francisco looked neat.

Ok, now that that’s out of the way. That’s seriously all the writers could come up? This whole season Alex Kurtzman has been saying that by the end of the season it would explain away all the canon inconsistencies. And their best shot is “everybody kept it a secret”? That made me actually laugh out loud because I wasn’t sure if it was a joke or not. An entire season, tens of millions of dollars spent just to ultimately say “everyone just pinkie promised to not talk about it”? It’s almost impressive what a middle finger that is to the audience.

So it turned out Michael Burnham was the Red Angel all along after all. Kinda makes that whole couple of episodes about her mom pointless. Also, was anyone expecting anything else? It was obvious from the first episode of the season it would turn out to be Michael Burnham, based on nothing else than the fact that the writers love making her the most important person in the universe. And the show treats that moment like it’s a shocking revelation. We were all ahead of the show there right?

Speaking of, I guess Discovery just happens to have the ability to replicate an Iron Man suit? I didn’t even know they had replicators. But they sure built that super advanced time traveling space suit in no time like it was nothing.

The non stop space battling was nauseating. It was full on Star Wars prequel white noise. I’m sure a bunch of animators were underpaid to create all those space battles that I had to close my eyes during because it was giving me a headache. This type of action is mind numbing and frankly, boring. Throwing more stuff at the screen isn’t exciting. For that matter, overly long scenes of people just punching each other isn’t exciting either. All I can think of is how intense and exciting Wrath Of Khan still is, and it was only two ships battling like they were slow moving submarines and not a single punch was thrown between Kirk and Khan.

And during the battle I noticed the Enterprise deployed a bunch of Star Wars repair droids that looked like Skeletor’s hover bots from the old Masters Of The Universe cartoon. Didn’t know they had those.

Admiral Cornwell’s death was ridiculous. So the only way to close the blast door was manually from the inside. Good thing the Enterprise designers created that room to be as dramatically convenient as possible. Why could they not beam her out of the room exactly? Also, this photon torpedo, that had the destructive capability of turning the Enterprise’s saucer section into a crescent shape was held off...by a blast door...is that what we’re being asked to believe? If the door was open, more of the ship would have blown up. But that one singular tiny door was so capable of holding that blast, Pike didn’t even flinch even though he was only a few feet away from it.

Leland wasn’t actually a bad guy right? Am I wrong there? His body was taken over by Skynet, right? It really bothered me how much the show reveled in the sadism of his death...this guy who was really just a victim.

Noticed they couldn’t resist ending another season without a “this is Starfleet” moment.

Security Chief what’s-her-name saying “yum yum”. I cringed out of my skin and now I’m a skeleton.

Didn’t really like Spock monologuing about how Michael Burnham is so great that she’s the reason he is who he is. I can’t believe how much the writers love making her the center of everything. No wonder she has this hero complex. Can’t really blame her. It would have been a missed opportunity not to have a goodbye between them though, so I can’t fully blame them there.

Seeing the bridge crew in the end, with the shots of the Enterprise in space dock was a neat TMP homage. And I appreciate Ethan Peck giving his all in the character, but boy howdy does the full Spock look not look good on him at all. Sad to say it was another laugh moment for me. I felt sorry for him. I also felt sorry for Rebecca Romijn in this. Her wig looked terrible. She herself was great though. I laughed again when she actually gave her name as “Number One”, but I’m sure that was an intentional joke moment.

The ending is intriguing in theory. Taking Discovery to the future frees up the show from a lot of constraints. However, it’s also emblematic of the writing problems in this show. The writers are literally having the show run away from what they think are its problems. They think taking the show out of prequel territory and eliminating all canon inconsistencies will fix the show, but that wasn’t the problem at all. The core problem is the writing style. Style over substance, weak characterization, lightning fast pacing, and boring overextended mystery box plots. Taking the show far into the future won’t fix this show alone. The writers need to fundamentally change how the show is written and structured for it to have a chance of really being good. Otherwise they’re just going to keep wasting tens of millions of dollars on fancy effects coupled with writing on par with bad fan fiction. We’ll see.
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