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Mertov
Sun, Feb 17, 2019, 10:17pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Saints of Imperfection

"Roddenberry's vision"
"Classic Trek"

Such elastic expressions. They can be conveniently shaped or molded according to the desires of various (and even opposite-minded) Trekkies.

Yet, when it comes to defining them, there is not one definition with which all Trekkies agree.
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Mertov
Sun, Feb 17, 2019, 9:02pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Saints of Imperfection

Understood Gil. I was just providing that because I saw you in an earlier post asking for sources. Didn't mean to across as crass, sorry if I did.
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Mertov
Sun, Feb 17, 2019, 9:01pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Saints of Imperfection

The bottomline is, the conspiracy gives sone DSC haters ammunition to claim that DSC is not canon. Except that facts don't line up with it.

And it's certainly a great thing that fans don't get to decide what's canon or not. Studios, franchise owners do. Or else, if it were left up to the fans, anything beyond the Original Series would not be called Star Trek since they each had substantial resistance from 'some' fan groups (as will future series of Star Trek, I gather).
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Mertov
Sun, Feb 17, 2019, 8:46pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Saints of Imperfection

And last but not the least.. if you notice, all the brouhaha is over the Enterprise's design anyway (even if the conspiracy theory held water). It's not about "Everything" having to be different.
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Mertov
Sun, Feb 17, 2019, 8:42pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Saints of Imperfection

Gil here is your primary source, directly from CBS TV Studios:
"CBS TV Studios does, in fact, have the right to use the U.S.S. Enterprise ship design from the past TV series, and are not legally required to make changes. The changes in the ship design were creative ones, made to utilize 2018’s VFX technology."
(You can find it in several links on search)

Those are the facts (again):
- Discovery is produced by Hideout Productions (Alex Kurtzman's company), Roddenberry Entertainment, and CBS Television Studios.
- Bad Robot's (JJ Abrams's studio) involvement is ZERO.
- 25% rule does not exist in this matter.
(Add: that is... if there is such thing as a 25% rule)

DSC under CBS, and CBS owns the full rights to Star Trek (TV). They don't have to do anything different. Everything else is a rumor, conspiracy theory.

Wow..
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Mertov
Sun, Feb 17, 2019, 3:28pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Saints of Imperfection

Oh, I am not excusing anything Dave. The quality of the show is up to the viewer to decide based on their expectations.

I am simply citing facts.

Facts that the youtube conspiracy-theorists like the one you use a source can't cite because the blah-blah they spew out offers convenient "conjectures" for the willing ear, like Bad Robot and CBS's (non-existent) connection and some (imaginary) 25% rule, and act like the legal reality of Discovery, being produced by Hideout Productions (Alex Kurtzman's company), Roddenberry Entertainment, and CBS Television Studios, with zero ties to Bad Robot, does not exist.
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Mertov
Sun, Feb 17, 2019, 3:07pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Saints of Imperfection

So your conjecture is that conspiracies must be right if the one conspired against does not sue them? LOL

There is no "CBS/Bad Robots" peeps with regard to DSC because Bad Robots is not involved in Star Trek Discovery (again, see facts above).

Repeating it what you want to believe 50 times will not magically make it true. Again, see facts (above).

---
Thomas,
Great comment.
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Mertov
Sun, Feb 17, 2019, 3:00pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Saints of Imperfection

Thanks for liking me though Dave :))
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Mertov
Sun, Feb 17, 2019, 2:59pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Saints of Imperfection

You are right about accepting information that one wants to hear, except I am not the one doing that. I do accept facts though. And researh will tell you the following FACTS:
- Discovery is produced by Hideout Productions (Alex Kurtzman's company), Roddenberry Entertainment, and CBS Television Studios.
- Bad Robot's involvement is ZERO.
- 25% rule does not exist.

Or.........
........ you can believe youtube conspiracists who use "sprinkled" facts here and there to make a largely conjectured speculation sound real to people who want to hear what they believe (meaning, the ones you thought was me, but actually is you).
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Mertov
Sun, Feb 17, 2019, 2:39pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Saints of Imperfection

Midnight's Edge is your source? LOL. The darling of all "STD" haters?

CBS has already issued a statement saying that they own the full intellectual rights.

Fact check no.1: Bad Robot is not involved in Star Trek Discovery.
Fact check no.2: There is no 25% rule.
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Mertov
Fri, Feb 15, 2019, 12:07am (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: An Obol for Charon

"An Obol for Charon" is a re-correction from last week's disjointed un-re-calibration — so that makes it an un-un-re-calibration, I guess? I'm hoping this season can stay a little more consistent so I don't run out of prefixes."

Hahahaha, classic!

Great review once again Jammer.
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Mertov
Fri, Feb 15, 2019, 12:00am (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Saints of Imperfection

***Spoilers -- For Leif**** (although leif, I'd suggest simply not reading the comments if you have not watched the episode, which is what I do too)



I agree with Shannon about Culber's resurrection (which was essentially fan service for the outrage between seasons). It was wrong to kill him in the first season and now they right'ed the wrong (supposedly) with another wrong (the outrageous recovery of Culber via... something). If that portion were taken out, Tilly's trip into the network and her interactions with May are actually o-kay, I could have even bought the "someone" being the monster line, but I knew it would be Culber as soon as that was pointed out earlier in the episode (plus his name was in the generic).

Like FELCommentary's related paragraph above, I also like the pacing of the Spock-search plotline. Director Barrett (who also directed "Magic Make the Sanest Man Go Mad") and performances of Wiseman, Mount, Yeoh, Van Sprang, Rapp, Latif did their best to save some of the mediocre scenes, but.....

I enjoyed the Discovery/Section 31/Yeoh/Pike/Latif related plotline and scenes. And of course, good visuals, as usual. I would rank this episode above "Point of Light" for the second season, but nowhere near episodes 1, 2, and 4. I would also be just fine if the Burnham monologues fell into oblivion, even though I like the character.
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Mertov
Wed, Feb 13, 2019, 8:38pm (UTC -6)
Re: TOS S1: Operation--Annihilate!

Amazing that two red shirts beam down to a hostile environment, spend substantial amount of time in dangerous condition, and neither dies! A rare occurrence.
Good review by Jammer, not a bad episode, even over three decades after the last watch.
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Mertov
Mon, Feb 11, 2019, 8:52pm (UTC -6)
Re: TOS S1: The Corbomite Maneuver

Good review Jammer. Some scenes are excessively long, but then again, the episode is almost 50 minutes long so it needs some of them to drag out considering that the main narrative does not advance until the very end. My first time seeing this in a couple of decades at least, probably third time total. My thoughts never change upon seeing it.

Great point by JohnC above with regard to Spock's comment to Bailey about keeping his voice down :))

Yeoman bringing coffee 2 minutes from destruction is so off the wall.

And what on earth was that crew member wearing in the foreground in those corridor scenes where they were being swung from wall to wall? LOL.
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Mertov
Mon, Feb 11, 2019, 12:25pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: An Obol for Charon

Rumble Red and BZ,
Great points. I remember Saru being deeply regretful in sickbay (or at least expressing alarm) over his own behavior on the planet in "Si Vis Pacem," after his first experience with not living with constant fear. I would think that he learned something from that. I also wonder if the Ba'ul are actually 'enlightened' Kelpiens which would bring in a sinister angle on that race, but would be consistent with what we know of Kelpiens (according to Saru). If so, it would put Saru in a unique position to tackle the issue of the two extreme existences. We shall see if this angle is explored in future episodes.
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Mertov
Sat, Feb 9, 2019, 8:29pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: An Obol for Charon

I didn't embrace Enterprise so much myself. Much less than DSC. So, there are guys like me too, who can then turn around and say by that reasoning: "so clearly, something was different this time" (with Enterprise).

By the way, people I mentioned in that post were not jusy 'guys' like you and me. One of them was Joan Verbe (one of the leading names in one of the few Star Trek organizing committees, I met her at a convention in nid-80s, and so were the others mentioned in that full-page article. We are not talking about random Trekkies.
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Mertov
Sat, Feb 9, 2019, 7:32pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: An Obol for Charon

The comfort of not having had Internet around when TNG and DS9 started (for example) and not having read the scathing reviews of those shows in their early years and claim that DSC is the only one generating negative reviews.
I remember distinctly a full-page news of the upheaval (on a prominent newspaper - Boston Globe?) when TNG began and bunch of Star Trek fans (including those leading the Trekkie fan groups) were all up in arms having a fit over how on earth such a show could carry the label "Star Trek."
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Mertov
Fri, Feb 8, 2019, 4:09pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: An Obol for Charon

Very solid episode. I’d put it in my top-three episodes of DSC, and I think it’s the second time I said that since Season 2 began. Anson Mount is continuing to kill it as Pike and Saru is fast becoming one of my favorite Trek characters. This was also one of Martin-Green’s better showings, the scenes with Saru and Michael were my favorite ones in the episode, along with the universal-translator malfunction one. Very engaging way to tackle it, with a number of languages spoken by the crew, and they played off the confusion well (I especially love Detmer’s look as she is talking), and it also aligned well with the sphere’s intent.

Mary Wiseman as Tilly is great in the engineering-room scenes, Stamets was fine too, I can’t say the same for Reno which kept “An Obol for Charron” from being close to perfect for me. I am a big fan of Tig Notaro and I loved Reno in “Brother,” but here her snark comes across misplaced, although she delivers them well, because the setting and the moment makes it inappropriate.

I’ll wait for Jammer’s review for the rest. Can’t wait for next week’s episode, it looks like a Tilly-centric one from the teaser.
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Mertov
Fri, Feb 8, 2019, 3:07pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: An Obol for Charon

Wow.. Less than 24 hours since the show aired, there are already 47 comments in which the bickering back and forth has commenced, with over 20 of the 47 comments coming from just three people.
Makes Rahul's second post in the comments section of last week's episode recommended reading, that's for sure.
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Mertov
Sat, Feb 2, 2019, 9:53pm (UTC -6)
Re: ORV S2: A Happy Refrain

Ok, for the semantic-lover in you, take out the "the fact that it's not accurate" part and replace it with "the fact that it may grossly turn out inaccurate". Happy now? :)
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Mertov
Sat, Feb 2, 2019, 7:49pm (UTC -6)
Re: ORV S2: A Happy Refrain

Of course Gil. By that reasoning, humans could very well not be not exploring other planets and humanoids (!!) in other planets by then either. Or maybe we did for about 20 years and some pissed off species in another galaxy came and obliterated the earth and we don't even exist at that time. Or, the earth could be in apocalypse mode and the 100 or so humans left on earth are cannibals looking for each other. We can only speculate on what we estimate, and the fact that it's not accurate is no groundbreaking news.
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Mertov
Sat, Feb 2, 2019, 12:07pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Point of Light

Understood Hank. Thanks for the input. Whether I disagree or not, I feel enriched by exchanges of this type.
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Mertov
Sat, Feb 2, 2019, 10:54am (UTC -6)
Re: ORV S2: A Happy Refrain

I am with Lynos above. This is definitely the kind of episode I was looking forward to seeing again. Best episode of second season for me. I understand where Jammer's coming from in his review (a good one again Jammer) and he backs it up very well. As he and Lynos both say, the premise is simply not believable. And I totally agree (and I said so back in episode 3 or 4 of first season) that Isaac's mask is a hindrance on the actor.

But like I said many times, I liked The Orville because of the humor/comedy factor, that is what it brings to the table in addition to TNG-style trek. And this one has quality chunks of it. I busted out laughing several times. For example, when Lamarr and Gordon were sprinting through the hallway, then again when Isaac turned the table, Kelly and Talla's expressions when they are listening to details from Claire, countless times he takes something said literally, and on and on. Give me more like this :)
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Mertov
Sat, Feb 2, 2019, 10:31am (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Point of Light

"To claim that they ARE the same thing, is just wrong, in my opinion, even though they share countless similarities. And of course this whole thing is feelings based, not scientifically provable on any level, or absolutely true one way or another. I just express my own, personal, subjective and emotional point of view on the matter."

If by your first sentence, you are implying (or saying) that "Discovery is not Star Trek, but the rest are," that's absurd, and that was my point in my post. And no they should not be the same thing (in the general sense) either. If DSC was a rehash of one older series (or more than one of them), I would then not watch it. There are hundreds of episodes available on Netflix if I want to do to that. That was one of the reasons why I liked Voyager a lot less than DS9, for example, because a lot of it was rehash of TOS and TNG.

But they are all Star Trek (to steal a sentence from someone above).
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Mertov
Fri, Feb 1, 2019, 11:24pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S2: Point of Light

Geez, what a letdown after the first two episodes! First of all, the non-stop camera movements are whiplash-y and make an already overpacked episode even less enjoyable. This episode needed to be at least an hour (or more, two-parter), or drop at least one of the storylines to give the others room to breathe a bit. AS to why they cannot make it an hour, I have no idea. Isn't that one of the advantages of streaming?

The trouble with this, is that even if the storylines have interesting tidbits in them, they get lost or remained unexplored due to the train-wreck race to the end of the episode. For example, Ash-L'Rell story could have been built so much better if it were an episode by itself. Ash's conflict would have been better developed, the interaction between houses would have been expanded, the introduction of the new ship, and Section 31 and Georgiou could have been sold better to the audience. But nope! It's flattened and crushed into a total of... 10 minutes?!?!

I'll wait for Jammer's review, but this one goes into the "fail" category for me.
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