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Fri, Jul 10, 2020, 9:06am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S3: Yesterday's Enterprise

Peter G. —

The issue that I take with this Christian moral framework is that it is slave morality, the universalizing of the plight imposed onto slaves — a slave is forced to sacrifice himself for the good or his master, what a slave morality does is to create a virtue of this oppression so that instead of being a humiliation and causing the slave to feel pathetic and weak, it is reframed as a beautiful and virtuous thing.

Essentially, most slaves could never hope to become a master, to use their strength to impose a set of values which serves them and their interests; instead, slave morality works by subversion, convincing the people to more or less enslave themselves by imbuing the indignities imposed on a slave with nobility. It’s this attitude that causes people to truly believe that the right thing to do is eschew what will make them happy, satisfied or even healthy/alive, to truly feel that it is better to fly into a losing battle voluntarily and die so that others might live is a superior option to living.

It is better to have the master’s morality. That begins with the fundamental realisation that there is no moral phenomena in the objective sense, only moral interpretations of phenomena and from this derives the fundamental principle that wrong is what is harmful to me and right is what is helpful or advantageous to me. In the context of “Yesterday’s Enterprise” it means that for Captain Picard it is right that the Enterprise C should return to the past and for the crew of the Enterprise C it means that it is right to remain in the future where at the very least there is possibility for survival.

“you really don't see how it would be a good thing to go to the defense of people being attacked by Romulans and die trying to save them? Having served, you would really argue that there is literally no point in participating in a rescue or defense action even if there is little chance of success? You don't see the value - both for morale and for honor - in finding it unacceptable to let defenseless people be gunned down, Klingon or otherwise? Because that's what this is about: how when the Klingons see Enterprise-C die fighting for them it cements the Khitomer Accords into a real alliance, because they realize it's not just a detente but that they're dealing with people with values?”

All of this is moot because no advantage or good can come to me if I am dead. That one might believe that it is the right and noble solution to sacrifice oneself in the most complete way to give others that advantage is because they’ve been indoctrinated to the lionisation of the plight of the slave.

I served partially because I was also indoctrinated into the morals of slavery, it took me awhile to realise that the safety, prestige, power etc of my country is meaningless to me if I am dead and that it is antithetical to the cause of *me* to die so that others can enjoy those things. That is not to say that all military service is a manifestation of slavery — the training, knowledge etc has and I suspect will continue to help me achieve my goals and ultimately I think that the experience of risking your life for that sake of others’ lives makes one realise that it is just not worth it, the sacrifice isn’t a noble ideal it’s the result of being more or less brainwashed into perpetuating your own smallness and powerlessness.
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Fri, Jul 10, 2020, 7:08am (UTC -5)
Re: TOS S1: The City on the Edge of Forever

--- Deleted Scene ---

McCoy: Jim!
Kirk: Bones!
(Curious, Edith starts to walk across the street unaware of car bearing down on her. Kirk starts to move towards her ...)
Spock: No Jim!!!
(Kirk stops and hold McCoy back....)
Car: Screeeeecccchhhh!
Edith: Angggmmgphhh!!!
McCoy: I could have saved her. Do you know what you just did?!!!
Spock: He knows Doctor. He knows .... oh, it looks like she's still alive....
Kirk: Really? Well shit. (pulls out phaser ...)

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Fri, Jul 10, 2020, 7:01am (UTC -5)
Re: TOS S1: Operation--Annihilate!

Best moment:

McCoy: We should run some more tests
Kirk: There's no time. Put Spock in there now!
McCoy: But ...
Kirk: Now Bones. Now!!!!!

-- later ---
Spock: I'm blind
Chapel: Here's the results of the test you order Dr. McCoy
McCoy: Oh dear. I didn't have to expose him to all wavelengths of light. He didn't have to be made blind.
Kirk: Bones! You f'd up!!
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Fri, Jul 10, 2020, 6:55am (UTC -5)
Re: TOS S1: The Enemy Within

Nimoy: Bill, the Transporter Special Effect has split your acting self
Shatner: What do you mean?
Nimoy: There's the classical trained actor doing Shakespeare, Ibsen, and Chekhov. A well-reviewed supporting role in "Judgement at Nuremberg" ...
Nimoy: And then there's the diva, the scene-chewer, a man for whom no line can be under-acted...
Shatner II: I'M CAPTAIN KIRK!!!!!
Shatner: What do I do? Help me.
Nimoy: We need another Transporter Special Effect to put you back together. The series needs both of you: the classically-trained actor and the over-acting diva.
Shatner: What if we just got rid of him?
Nimoy: Bill, you couldn't even land a job as a game show host.
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Fri, Jul 10, 2020, 1:31am (UTC -5)
Re: ENT S2: Precious Cargo

Meh, other than the questionable acting by the lady, it’s about as good as any Enterprise episode.

To be more fair, maybe 5% of Enterprise episodes are good to great. The other 95% are about like this one. At least this one wasn’t boring.
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Fri, Jul 10, 2020, 1:07am (UTC -5)
Re: DS9 S5: Blaze of Glory

I might give this episode half a star less than Jammer did. It does raise a bunch of very interesting questions and it takes time running through the ideas that they bring up, without stooping to giving the viewer an easy answer about any of it, but at the same time, it feels really forced.

Looking at the big picture, and thinking as a TV Producer, you have to admit, having this many Bad Guys in a TV Series could get to be unmanageable by a certain point (I shudder to think of what the writing room whiteboards looked like by this time). When the Dominion 'allied' with Cardassia, I feel like it was meant to consolidate the Bad Guys in the show so that the episodes would be easier to write without having to give a lot of exposition.

We all know certain sequences of lines in movies, TV, or whatever, that come off as transparent exposition. If a show does this badly, it shows. Characters talking about recent events in an extremely specific way that is a not-so-subtle *wink-wink* to audience members who might be having trouble keeping up.

DS9 had its hands full with this kind of thing for a while. With this episode (and logically speaking, "By Inferno's Light" before it), it basically did what it had to do; reduce the number of players on the chessboard to streamline the overall plotline of the series.

I can't deny that it was an effective decision; choosing one path and focusing on it is always better than letting oneself be carried away by a multitude of concerns. But the way in which it was done feels just a tad, a tad and a half, maybe two tads rushed.

Random woman contacts "Michael." Says missiles are launched. Then we find out that this random woman is Mrs. Eddington? Then they are forced to separate, and Eddington is killed. We get one reaction shot from her, and that's it. Her fate is sealed; she never reappears in the series (or any Trek series) again.

That's a waste of a scene, waste of a character, and a waste of a plot thread. If they were just going to kill Eddington anyway, parading around a beautiful woman he has just had nuptials with has a 'salt on rice' effect... it makes it taste more like something, but the flavor isn't very good, and it would have been better just to have steamed rice, after all, bland as it may be that way.

Eddington breathing her name in his last breath is the only reason I remember Rebecca's name. Let's put it that way. It just felt a little bit lame. I wish they'd devoted at least a bit more time to playing up the drama of this horrible tragedy; I have this problem with a lot of DS9. It tells you that these events are horrible and tragic, and looking at them on paper, you would agree, but it doesn't SHOW you the tragedy. It doesn't make FEEL the tragedy.

I'm not saying that it's a bad episode, it was pretty good, honestly. But I'd rate it a hair lower than Jammer did. It just has a couple of typical DS9-ish rushed beats.
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Eric Saavedra
Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 11:50pm (UTC -5)
Re: DS9 S7: Chimera

Great show but one of my complaints here is how much the changelings can take different forms. Seriously?? Fog and fire?? How can they give off heat and light as fire without losing mass? Also in the opening scene when Lass was bigger than the shuttle or when Odo becomes as small as a bird in other episodes. They should have limited the changelings to physical sizes comparable to their volume and not be able to become “energy forms” such as fire.
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Cody B
Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 10:08pm (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S7: Natural Law

@Dave in MN

Probably written by a white person who thinks they “understands THEIR (non whites) side of things”. Irony is race is on their mind much more than the people they deem the enemy.
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Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 8:02pm (UTC -5)
Re: DS9 S4: Little Green Men

“They irradiated their own planet?”

Always reminds me of an old Asimov story where first contact with Earth is about to happen, and then the aliens realize humans have tested nukes on Earth. They decide we are fools, and pass us by.
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Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 7:49pm (UTC -5)
Re: DS9 S4: Little Green Men

Great pulp SF, nothing more, nor does it try to be. I love how DS9 never forgets their roots.
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Top Hat
Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 7:42pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S1: The Neutral Zone

The matter is revisited in "Q Who?":

DATA: There is a system of roads on this planet, which indicates a highly industrialised civilisation. But where there should be cities there are only great rips in the surface.
WORF: It is as though some great force just scooped all the machine elements off the face of the planet.
DATA: It is identical to what happened to the outposts along the Neutral Zone.

The intention is that it was the Borg. Nothing comes of the informal Romulan/Federation pact on the topic, however.
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Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 7:41pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S1: The Neutral Zone

Did future TNG episodes ever elaborate on what caused all the Federation starbases to simply disappear? At one point there is a comment like "the station was ripped off the face of the planet", or some such. Did they ever explain what could do that?

Was it the Romulans all along, murdering vast numbers of Federation citizens? It seems doubtful, since the Romulans said they had some disappearances on their side of the Neutral Zone too.

Was this just a dangling thread that was left forever dangling? It's too early for the Borg to be the cause of it, so it must have been some other tremendously powerful entity.
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Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 5:41pm (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S7: Endgame

Doc should have been gay. Could pair him off with Barclay; would have made a great couple. Hologram-addict engineer and sentient hologram: perfect match.
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Dave in MN
Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 5:35pm (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S7: Natural Law


racist statement.

I'm not sure why it's ok nowadays to stereotype an entire race, but it's very ignorant and completely antithetical to what Trek stands for.
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Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 5:16pm (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S7: Natural Law

Story alludes to colonialism and destruction of natural resources. This is hard for white people to understand.
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James G
Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 3:22pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: Half a Life

I've been ploughing through TNG from the beginning for the last 18 months or so at a rate of about five episodes a month. A couple of weeks ago, while skimming through an episode guide, I noticed that 'Half a Life' was looming on the horizon, a few episodes in my future.

So I quickened my TNG viewing schedule a bit, to time it to land on my 60th birthday. Today.

I do remember watching this one before, some time in the mid '90s. Probably on one of the UK satellite channels.

I like this one quite a bit in many ways, actually. Nice to see the late David Ogden Stiers in something other than M*A*S*H, and he shows his versatility here in a nicely understated, hugely dignified performance, a far cry from Major Winchester. I've seen him in very few other TV shows or films, come to think of it. The only other thing I can think of is an episode of 'Rhoda'. I believe he was actually in his late 40s when this was filmed.

I'm not a fan of the Lwaxana episodes as a rule - I don't find the character at all believable or interesting and the joke wore thin in the first one she appears in - but here at least, we see a different side of her after the initial overbearing / annoying act gets rolled out again.

It's quite a nice idea. I did find it unsettling in the present circumstances, by which I mean being 60 years old as of today. It's a hard thing to get used to as it is. I can barely believe it, quite honestly. So the theme of this story, and especially its conclusion, made me feel disturbed; perhaps even a little angry.

I would have liked to have had some sort of acknowledgement that a year on another planet isn't necessarily the same duration as an Earth year, given that it's a unit of time that's central to the story. But that's a nit-pick.

Right, I'm off to take an overdose for the good of human society.
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Dave in MN
Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 3:14pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S1: The Naked Now

Data initially was envisioned as being an android with flesh components ... hence the reason he became intoxicated.
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Mr Peepers
Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 1:55pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S1: The Naked Now

Showing that Data gets drunk is as big a fail as when they showed Luke and Leia making out. It two more films before they reversed course and made them brother and sister. After this episode season, Data didn't even have emotions, much less et drunk. Reminds me of the first season of TOS, where Spoke was shown to smile. He later became serious as a heart attack.
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Baby Mandalorian
Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 9:56am (UTC -5)
Re: DS9 S7: What You Leave Behind

I think it was a strong end. It improved upon the first season and followed through mostly. My only let downs were dukat and winn which was a solid waste of time the last half of the season. Both characters were kind of wasted, not because they are bad actors just I think they were contrived to produce the final half narrative as the protagonists, but it made no sense or was forced. That whole story was a bit awkward.

Otherwise everything else went pretty good. I felt there could have been a more climactic space battle, but I guess Trek doesn't excel in that. I liked Ezri but it was all forced just because Jadzia left. I wonder what really happened with her leaving.... i feel like there is some #metoo stuff that happened but maybe thats wishful thinking.

Worf was super annoying this entire season. He seemed really out of character and just a man-child behaviour. The only good outcome near the end was him fighting the Jem hadar (sp) on that asteroid in a previous episode. Otherwise his drama was insufferable with Ezri and constantly complaining, the complete opposite of what you'd think a Klingon would carry themselves- plus the constnat use of the word honour made it lose meaning.

Miles + Chief were amazing as always. Thank god there wasn't any obrien wife this season, from memory. She should have always just been a reference character.

Anyway, good episode, a decent ending. Left some open threads and storylines that could (or maybe could have 20 years ago) be explored more.
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Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 5:15am (UTC -5)
Re: DS9 S3: The Die Is Cast

There's something enjoyable in the fact that, a few episodes later ("Family Business"), the replacement for the runabout they lose here (the Mekong) is named the Rubicon. The Caesar references don't stop in the two-parter.
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Dave in MN
Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 3:34am (UTC -5)
Re: DS9 S7: Badda-Bing, Badda-Bang

Elie, bonjour!

Since you only ingest the biased drivel fed to you by the media, here's some hard mathematics. A fraction of a fraction of a percent of people in our country have been out on the streets. 99.9% of the 330 million people in or population have went about their daily lives and not participated.

I seem to recall quite a few nationwide French street riot/protests in the last decade hat involved a much larger percent of the populace .... and plenty of destruction.

Going by your standard, France might as well be considered Thunderdome.
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Peter G.
Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 1:26am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: Brothers

@ james04,

"If Reg Barclay, or any other member of the crew, had done what Data did, they would have been thrown off the Enterprise & out of Starfleet"

Except for the fact that Reg Barclay *does* do almost exactly what Data did in The Nth Degree...and they don't throw him out.
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Thu, Jul 9, 2020, 12:47am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: Brothers

Data gets away with activities bordering on mutiny. For all the fine talk about Data being sentient, etc., Picard shows he does not in his heart of hearts believe that, by letting Data off with what the episode shows are zero consequences. If Reg Barclay, or any other member of the crew, had done what Data did, they would have been thrown off the Enterprise & out of Starfleet quicker than you can say “The existence of Section 31 proves that Starfleet is a bunch of sanctimonious hypocrites”.

But Data is, after all, nothing but a machine, with no more moral sense or conscience than a bar of gold-pressed latinum. That this is Picard’s truest conviction on the matter, is absolutely proven by the absence of any penalty for behaviour which, in any other member of the crew, would (rightly) have been regarded as gravely criminal. ST cannot have it both ways - and its attempting to do so, does not say much for the moral pretentions of ST.

TOS managed its treatment of Spock much better, even if that series did have the advantage of comparative brevity. Making Data an android with plausibly human features was a mistake. Voyager handled the Doctor with much greater artistic tact than TNG managed. Data is allowed to become insufferable, a robotic and backward version of Picard at his preachiest - Voyager avoids this, by deflating the Doctor now and again, so that he is never allowed to make the blunders Data does; and by dividing his functions between the Doctor, and Seven of Nine. The Doctor is amusing. The relationship between the Doctor and Seven is amusing. The relationship between McCoy & Spock is amusing. Data’s attempts at humour are flat, not sparkling,

Usually, episodes show Data acting, and being treated as, a moral agent. In this episode, and some others, the mask slips.
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Cody B
Wed, Jul 8, 2020, 11:47pm (UTC -5)
Re: ENT S2: Regeneration


Ahhh okay that makes sense I must have missed when they said it was the research ship. This was a great episode. The beginning seemed like a homage to the movie The Thing and ten it turned into just plain good Borg episode
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Baby Mandalorian
Wed, Jul 8, 2020, 10:54pm (UTC -5)
Re: DS9 S7: Badda-Bing, Badda-Bang

Yikes, Elie you need to lay off the drugs.

This was a good episode, I enjoyed it for a filler- typical adventure heist with comedy, drama and suspense.

It's interesting seeing the comments from the last decade and a half on race. Just makes me realise more and more that DS9 (and Avery) were very well placed to address race issues amongst others. Although the Ableist episode was a big joke.
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