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OmicromThetaDeltaPhi
Thu, Aug 13, 2020, 2:19am (UTC -5)
Re: Star Trek: Lower Decks

Even if Seth didn't directly write most of the epsiodes of Family Guy, he was a very active show-runner for many years, and he set that show's tone.

Many avid Family Guy fans say that when McFarlane stopped doing that (which was years ago) the show lost its way. Lost its edge, if you will.

Kinda like the Simpsons. Or Star Trek, come to think of it.
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Booming
Thu, Aug 13, 2020, 1:36am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Drumhead

Here is a nice one which shows how to be racist without saying black:"The ‘suburban housewife’ will be voting for me, they want safety & are thrilled that I ended the long running program where low income housing would invade their neighborhood.”
Trump stopped the "invasion of their neighborhoods" from "low income" people.

That was a program that tried to mix in low income black people into more wealthy suburbs because studies show that the whites don't lose anything and the new black neighbors prosper significantly.

Here the more legal definition:"It requires cities and towns which receive Federal money for any housing or urban development related purpose to examine whether there are any barriers to fair housing, housing patterns or practices that promote bias based on any protected class under the Fair Housing Act, and to create a plan for rectifying fair housing barriers."
(yeah it only applied if you wanted federal money for housing projects)

Good that Trump saved the "suburban housewife" from being "invaded" by "low income" people.
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Trent
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 10:59pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Drumhead

Omicron said: "Anything they don't like, and this can be for the silliest and pettiest of reasons, they strive to erase from existence. Whether it's a national monument..."

The "national monuments" were overwhelmingly erected in the south as part of the "Lost Cause Movement". Stuff like the Robert E. Lee, Jefferson Davis, and PGT Beauregard statues were not erected just to honor these men, but to assert the values of the Confederacy, open and unrepentant white supremacy and total disregard for the humanity of black people.

And most of the statues were put up in the 20th century, when Civil Rights Movements were pushing for desegregation. They are not "old" statues. They're new monuments put up in the thousands by some pretty disgusting organizations to troll, send a message about white supremacy, and to sentimentalize people who had actively fought to preserve slavery.

That some "innocent statues" get caught in the crossfire of attacks on Confederate statues is surely small potatoes.

People also need to let go of the idea of "polite", "perfect soul" protest movements. There are no saints. And when violence determines the central questions of political life - statehood, territoriality, power and property - and when the "nice society" you live in is the result of centuries of brutal culling, its naive to expect major protest movements to be pious.

Speaking of cancel culture, the FBI says white supremacists were responsible for 78 percent of extremist murders last year (a 31 percent increase in hate crimes from 2014). In response, the government has recently disbanded the Homeland Security department dedicated to domestic terrorism and right-wing extremists.

SenSors said: "Yeah, you're really set on fighting racism but this whole "police brutality" things sounds like a lot of hoopla amirite?"

The conservative tends to see police violence as necessary, or an understandable accident. "Certain races" commit more crime, are genetically or culturally predisposed to commit more crime, and so get shot more, deservedly or accidentally. To solve crime, they advocate more cops, more gear, harsher sentences.

Lefties, meanwhile, tend to think holistically. The science says poverty overwhelmingly causes crime, and overwhelmingly causes social conditions which cause health problems or forms of social alienation which in turn tends to lead to crime. Address poverty and you address crime and you address racist cops.

Of course the conservative then says poverty is itself a product of "improper culture", "personal choices" or even "bad genetics". It must be, because the system the individual finds itself in is inherently meritocratic, fair, equal and makes sense. And so racist cops are justified because the system works.

The lefty, of course, says the opposite. The system is inherently unfair, unequal, hard free will is a myth, and capitalism is inherently exclusionary, breeds a paristized underclass, a permanently unemployed class, an indebted class, and so the conditions of crime, and so racist cops.

And so you get your impasse. How you view the BLM movement will probably be determined by your own class, position on the political spectrum and religious beliefs. Some studies, for example, show that Christians, or those who believe in Just World Theory, instinctively tilt toward supporting cops more. A demonic-heathen sociologist like Booming will probably do the opposite, instinctively sympathizing with BLM folk.
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Sigh2000
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 10:35pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S5: I, Borg

Correction: "after all that his collective has done to *all* of those innocent people?"
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Sigh2000
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 10:20pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S5: I, Borg

"I Borg" has some great moments, but really disgusts me.

First off:
The opening scene was really a hoot. Troi, Picard and Riker are shown 'just sitting around' watching solar flares, while everybody else on the ship is busy surveying six solar systems.
Picard is little more than a lounge lizard. I was compelled to ask out loud: "DON'T ANY OF THESE PEOPLE DO ANYTHING?"

Second off: why "third of five" but later "seven of nine"? Hey guys: do Borg use ordinal numbers or cardinal numbers in naming themselves? Please tell us poor souls, oh wonder linguists of Trek.


Inconsistencies abound within the ideological slurry the writers serve up. Let's give medical care to the poor injured cyborg.

The episode is ingenious insofar as it gets us to ask ourselves if we are in our right minds to help this poor dumb kid. Can we actually be objectively interested with his so-called 'civilization' after Wolf 359? And after the earlier Borg cutting beam incident (in Q Who) which sliced out a circle of the Enterprise saucer section the size of eight houses in Levitown? Oh...and what about the razed colony at the beginning of BOBW pt. 1; etc. etc. etc. and the destruction of countless other worlds, some of which we assume were sensitive, creative and genuinely filled with millions of good beings just minding their own business (like Guinan's group).

Is it right to feel the need to make nicey nicey after all that? Is it logical for us to be humane to Hugh after all that his collective has done to of those innocent people?

Of course we, as god-fearing mortals, will work to save the life of the individual who is found unconscious, and not met with as a cog within a virtually unbeatable killer-cube that has annihilated so much independent life.

I really disliked Beverly's tone...it's ok to phaser them to ashes inside the killer-cube; but once injured and lying on the ground we must repair them, and treat them as one of the gang. If this had been done in our own world history, Nineveh would never have fallen and we would still be paying tribute to the bloody Assyrians.

Yet somehow, she's right. That is the conundrum confronting our species. I don't like this episode at all.
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Tomalak
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 9:34pm (UTC -5)
Re: Star Trek: Lower Decks

I didn't know that! What I've seen of Family Guy is a lot of absurd, over the top and often out of context jokes delivered in dream sequences.

Whereas the Orville is more full of subtle amusing moments - like the subtle reactions of crew when the interim security chief was eating smelly meals on the bridge. Not crazy funny (then again FG isn't crazy funny either) but finding humour in a realistic, relatable way.
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Sen-Sors
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 9:23pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Drumhead

Jason R, if police reform isn't happening it's surely not for lack of trying on behalf the populace. Why would you blame the inaction of politicians (who often takes tons of money from police unions) on the protestors? Also Cori Bush was just elected to Congress on a BLM platform. They're working on it.

As for actual solutions to police reform, you say BLM has offered no solutions. This is not true. "Defund the police" is not an empty slogan, nor is it the same as "abolish the police". It means we should reduce the bloated budgets of many police departments and put that money towards social services that will alleviate crime and poverty without armed officers being solution to every problem. It means more money for social workers, shelters, schools, low-income housing and work programs.

Other concrete police reforms include reducing all the surplus military equipment they have, civilian oversight boards so that the police are not the ones investigating their own misconduct, and ending qualified immunity for police officers. These policy solutions have been voices many times, but you don't seem to be listening.

ODTP, are you for real? According to people who actually live there, Portland protests averaged around 100 demonstraters per night and only in the downtown area. It was in no way a "war zone" outside the fever-dream coverage of right wing media. These demonstrator numbers exploded once Trump sent in his DHS and Border Patrol goons in in a blatant attempt to bolster his "law and order" campaign for re-election. If you can't see the connection between his re-election campaign, his repeated calls for a military crackdown in US cities and his executive order sending unmarked officers into cities to throw people into unmarked vans without a warrant than you probably shouldn't be talking US politics. I gave you the links. Where's the lie?

Here's a link to an on-the-ground perspective from Portland: https://www.wired.com/story/portland-protests-online/

"Please point to any call of violation of rights in these documents."

Oh damn, dude. You got me. If the official government documents don't explicitly call for the violation of citizens rights in the text, then that means everything is on the level! You're good at this!

Oh wait, there's that thing called the Fourth Amendment, you probably haven't heard of it so I'll post it here:

"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

This is why it's a problem for unmarked federal agents in camo to pull you off the street into an unmarked van without telling you why, offering no warrant and holding you indefinitely. If you're breaking the law in public, there's no reason a clearly labeled policeman can't arrest you properly. But again, this is about Trump looking tough and using the Border Patrol and DHS to do it. The DHS memo speaks of how they want to expand this operation into other cities, which will only further inflame the protests and lead to more violence which is, of course, the point. Trump gets to point to the crazy protestors and how America needs the military to crack down. Intimidation and violence. Apparently you're fine with it.

And yea, any yahoo can rent a van, buy some surplus camo gear and go pulling people they don't like off the street if that's what the unmarked Feds are doing. Who could tell the difference? You seriously don't see that as an issue?

Also that whooshing you heard is my point about riots going right over your head.

"Makes me wonder, what percentage of the protests are about this kind of nonexistent evils..."

Ah, there it is. Yeah, you're really set on fighting racism but this whole "police brutality" things sounds like a lot of hoopla amirite?

I think you're very uninformed about the most basic aspects of US law as well as current events. It's funny that Jason R says that BLM hasn't done anything substantial and then you claim that society has bent over backwards to accommodate it. Well, which is it?
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Trent
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 8:06pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S5: The Masterpiece Society

@MrPeepers' "This society would bore me to death. You are told that according to your genetic profile, you'll make an excellent sanitation engineer. "

Now that I think about it, this episode is about the counselor falling in love with the president of the Planet of Guidance Counselors.
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Trent
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 8:01pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Drumhead

lol, Booming why are you always getting everyone angry?

Regarding the conversation above, IMO we've seen this all before, countless times.

Civil rights movements tend to be tiny, and made up a very small percentage of your population. The majority of your population is usually indifferent to the movement, with conservative factions manically opposing it, and liberal types paying it lipservice.

The movement starts out peaceful and cool, it grows, and it absorbs lots of different factions. Because progressivism in general is all about unknown, uncertain and competing futures, you quickly get lots of different factions pulling in different directions. Because the system rarely concedes anything, these factions are typically ineffectual.

Gradually, for various reasons, the movement becomes more radical and more violent. Everyone starts hating the group. This animosity goes on for years until some generations pass and suddenly everyone seems to magically agree with the movement. Nobody knows when this agreement happened or why.

Consider the way the Suffragette movement is positively portrayed today, despite the fact that they were outright terrorists.

In the early 1900s, during what was dubbed "the Suffragette Outrages", there was a nationwide bombing and arson campaign. Suffragettes even violently attacked a young Winston Churchill with whips. Others disguised themselves and attacked members of Parliament, and even the Prime Minister, tossing a hatchet which cut off the ear of a man nearby. Some tried to burn down the Royal Theater, using canisters of gunpowder. Others attacked museums and defaced artwork. Displays at the British Museum were destroyed and bombs planted in St Paul's Cathedral. They cut telegraph wires, set mail boxes on fire, and were jailed by the hundreds.

All of this behavior was deemed irrational, stupid and counterproductive. It was deemed tactless, thoughtless, extreme, obscene and violent. And the purveyors of these "bad tactics" were deemed crazy, sexist, hate-filled zealots bent on destroying the social order.

But what do you expect? Imagine the conditions necessary to provoke someone into becoming a Suffragette. Imagine the psychology of such a person. If you're a Suffragette who views the system as obscene, and all your countrymen as being blind to these obscenities, why are you going to care what the rest of humanity has to say about your actions? You don't. You throw gasoline at a postbox and try to whip Churchill.

This just seems to be a natural part of societies and social movements. Violence and unrest has itself preceded most major systemic changes over the past couple of hundred years. A psycho gunning down folk in New Zealand recently led immediately to gun bans. In the UK, decades ago, a single spree shooting quickly led to similar massive gun bans. The Women's Suffrage movement, Abolition of Slavery, the Civil Rights Movement, the LGBT rights movement, all included large violent protests which were ridiculed but which resulted in changes which would not have been achieved anywhere close to as quickly without the violence. It took the church bombing of 4 little black girls to spur the 1964 civil rights act. It took King's murder - he had a 70+ percent disapproval rating when he died - and mass riots to finally sign the Civil Rights Act of 68.

It's always the same story. BLM will get bashed. Extinction Rebellion will get bashed. Those Pussy Riot chicks in Russia will get bashed. But your grandkids will love them! They'll be taught in school about the weirdos who thought "Black Lives Matter" is racist, about the scientific literature behind the willfully misunderstood "Defund the Police" slogan...then they will probably jump on their hover-boards and go out and lynch some poor cyborgs.

IMO social systems are like living organisms. The hardiest and most intractable survive, and they survive as they are because the conditions which would make them otherwise don't exist. The cybernetician Gregory Bateson, whose work intersected with biology, said hardy systems (he was speaking of capitalism as a legal framework) also only allow false binaries and false choices which don't threaten the system. The avenues the system offer you tend to be dead ends. To rupture something so bent on survival, needs massive levels of wacky and often violent crap.
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Mr Peepers
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 7:32pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S5: The Masterpiece Society

The scene with Geordi saying he was glad he wasn't aborted because he was blind, reminded me of a Chris Rock skit.

"Doctors haven't cured anything in the last 50 years. Like blindness. You go blind, they don't got nothing for you. You go to a doctor, tell him you're blind, he says, "Hey why don't you get this dog to drag your blind butt around."

This society would bore me to death. Everyone is perfect, and nothing ever goes wrong. You are told that according to your genetic profile, you'll make an excellent sanitation engineer. It's what you were bred to do. I doubt you would be allowed to change professions because Martin will tell you that will upset the alignment of the stars or some other nonsense.

Hard to believe with these people's advanced scientific minds, they wouldn't build a few spacecraft to check out what other planets are doing. In 200 years, all they have done was create a few glass domes. How about finding a new planet where you can breathe fresh air?

And once again, Picard disapproves of any female senior staff member from getting a little action unless he is getting some too. Troi and Crusher and never had a relationship with anyone aboard ship, except Troi , who mostly grinds on Riker. He and the Captain do their do off the ship. Both hangout on Risa to get some action. It's no wonder these females hookup with some alien visitor before the first commercial break. Are they even sexually compatible? If you have spots, or a ridge on your forehead, I can't imagine what they got down below. Crusher hooked up with an alien whose body is controlled by a giant maggot. That copulation would totally gross me out. YUCK!!

These people would get along great with that planet that was made up of clones to survive. Both were made up of leaders who were insufferable dictators. Both were isolated and living with issues that were totally unnecessary. When a Starship visited, they all should had jumped onboard and got off the rock they were merely existing on, instead of lying and claiming their way of life was perfect.
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Trent
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 6:05pm (UTC -5)
Re: Star Trek: Lower Decks

Seth has written almost all of the Orville's episodes, and has only written about 3 episodes of Family Guy, so maybe the former is more indicative of how he prefers to write.
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Tomalak
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 2:32pm (UTC -5)
Re: Star Trek: Lower Decks

Yeah I am another one here who really doesn't like Family Guy or find it funny - but likes the Orville, including for its humour.
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OmicronThetaDeltaPhi
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 12:29pm (UTC -5)
Re: Star Trek: Lower Decks

@Marlboro

The Orville is completely different beast from anything else McFarlane has ever produced, though.

I personally can't stand any of his other stuff, but he really toned down both the humor and the irreverent tone for the Orville. To me, it was toned enough to be an acceptable evil in the first few episodes, and later on it actually became a positive spice on an otherwise decent story.

So you might want to give the show another chance. It just might surprise you.
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CaptainMercer
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 12:02pm (UTC -5)
Re: Star Trek: Lower Decks

@Marlboro
I am not a huge fan of it wither, but he reogned it in after the first two episodes of the Orville. For example, in family guy and his Family Guy Star Wars spoofs, he mastered the art of the prolonged joke.. something that starts as kond of funny but he thinks it will be funnier by virtue of it lasting longer than its breaking point. He only teies this ONCE in Orville, in the first minites of the second episode, when Ed's parents call him from an alien ship. I think that is still the kind of humor from the pilot. After that point, the humor in the show overall becomes much much smarter
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Booming
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 11:56am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Drumhead

Omicron let's make this clear once and for all.
I stopped talking to you a while back because you insulted me, then I stopped doing that. Now you have insulted me again repeatedly during the last seven days. So yeah I choose to no longer interact with you because I consider it a waste of time.
But you are right, not talking to you is like a Human rights violation and clearly shows my murderous convictions.

I hope you can live with this horrible injustice.

Or here is another spin. I, after you behaved poorly, made a choice to no longer talk to you and informed you about that. Instead of respecting that, you write post after post further insulting me. What are you? A 12 year old?
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Marlboro
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 11:54am (UTC -5)
Re: Star Trek: Lower Decks

I just don't like Seth Macfarlane's style of humor. "A Million Ways to Die in the West" pretty much ended any shot of me tuning in to anything he produces.
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OmicronThetaDeltaPhi
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 11:09am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Drumhead

I just find it funny, that a guy who supports signs that say "silence is violence" and lectures others to "put aside their fears" and "engage in conversation", is in the habit of giving commenters he doesn't like the silence treatment.

I also think there's a direct parallel between this silly situation here and the more serious issues we are talking about.

Because that's always the way with these guys, isn't it? Anything they don't like, and this can be for the silliest and pettiest of reasons, they strive to erase from existence. Whether it's a national monument, a professor with an unpopular opinion, or anything else.

All in the name of tolerance, diversity and social justice, of course.
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Mark
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 11:01am (UTC -5)
Re: ENT S2: The Expanse

My problem with this one was this: photonic torpedoes. Enterprise was already stretching credibility with phase pistols and phase cannons, basically the same weapons that are used 220 years later. Now, it seems that that applies to the entire Starfleet arsenal. Phasers and photon torpedoes in 2153, phasers and photon torpedoes in 2373. That's like our troops using Brown Bess muskets and muzzle loading cannons.
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Jason R.
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 10:57am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Drumhead

"Have you ever had an actual calm conversation with a BLM supporter?"

No and I never will because if I said the wrong thing, I could be harrassed doxxed or fired from my job. But I do read plenty of newspapers where I get exposure to these viewpoints pretty regularly. There are no shortage of newspapers in Canada willing to give BLM a megaphone for its views.
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Peter G.
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 10:31am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Drumhead

@ Booming,

You are not completely in touch with the spread of common beliefs among protesters and BLM in particular if you think "defund the police" is a mis-statement of "reallocate funds appropriately". For some it means that, for others it means what it sounds like: no more funds for the police, and no more police (that entire infrastructure presumably to be replaced by something else).

As for fistfights, you also have to be utterly tone deaf to think that the main threat coming to someone dissenting at this point in time is a physical assault. There are plenty of other ways to ruin someone, and the tools of the trade seem to include being cancelled, fired, doxxed, ostracized, etc etc. Death threats are a thing endemic all over the place right now so that's not unique to this, but probably happens also.
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Booming
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 10:27am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Drumhead

@Peter G.
As somebody who was in a few dozen brawls and was trained in personal combat by the military my fear of middle class university students is fairly limited. :)

Most of these people were never in a fight. I'm also fairly certain that not a single white person was killed by a BLM supporter in Canada. The threat assessment based on this sign seems excessive. Also when you go back in US history then you will see that speculating that black rights protest are actually about murdering white people, is very old and so far during the last 160 years never came true.

"You might want to ask why the sign said "silence is VIOLENCE" rather than something more agreeable like "silence keeps things the same" or "silence helps the wrong side.""
Oh, the left often has a unique talent to choose stupid phrases. Defund the police is another one. In actuality they mean:" End over-policing of certain areas and use the bloated police budgets for stuff that actually improves the situation of these areas which then decreases crime." but I guess that wasn't as catchy. Instead they choose "Defund the police" which makes achieving their goals a lot harder. So yeah, not a good choice.
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OmicronThetaDeltaPhi
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 10:12am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Drumhead

@Peter G.
"These types of arguments tend to discredit even the good points the left makes, which is why they should dissociate themselves with these 'allies' asap."

Booming's comparison of these protesters to the victims of the ****-ing holocaust isn't doing their cause any favors either.
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OmicronThetaDeltaPhi
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 10:02am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Drumhead

@Booming

Context is everything.

Yes, generally speaking, a sign saying "silence is violence" isn't necessarily a bad thing.

But we are currently living in crazy times, where protestors all over the country are in the habit of bullying others into surrendering to their every whim, and viewing any other response as "racism".

We've seen this played out a gazillion times in the past two months.

So yes, when *this* specific crowd is holding a sign that says "silence is violence" that's a form of bullying.

And they are not stupid. They know perfectly well that this is the effect they are creating. They *want* the local population to fear them. That's the whole point of the entire endeavor.

So you want us to have a chat with these guys? No problem. If they put down those deliberately provocative signs and stop trying use intimidation as their only mode of communication, I'm sure Jason would be happy to invite them for a nice cup of coffee.
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Peter G.
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 9:56am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Drumhead

@ Booming,

Let me help to explain one point Jason R is making (if I may):

"That sign really rattled you. A less emotional response seems appropriate."

It's only appropriate if the message is innocuous or benevolent.

But here is that Jason R said:

"You want to know why it's a threat? Because if saying nothing is "violent" then that means by saying nothing I am literally *attacking* someone."

You might want to ask why the sign said "silence is VIOLENCE" rather than something more agreeable like "silence keeps things the same" or "silence helps the wrong side." But no, it is 'violence'. You need to be tone deaf not to realize this type of phrasing is related to the language used on certain university campuses, where you hear talk of feeling "threatened" by something (e.g. a teacher stating a conservative opinion) and that this threat is reported as making the environment "unsafe", which results in a firing for 'endangering' the students. If you think the word "violence" in the poster is just an accident or a metaphor, you are mistaken; they mean it when they say they consider it as violence. I can see Jason R's POV to take that poster as basically meaning "either you're with us, or else whatever happens you to - you had it coming." And you do see semblances of that in both cancel culture and in internet mobbing/doxxing.

While I can see merit to both sides of the discussion on the protests and so forth, there's no need to play the motte and bailey game about plain language to try to say it means something even though it clearly wants you to understand it another way. These types of arguments tend to discredit even the good points the left makes, which is why they should dissociate themselves with these 'allies' asap.
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Booming
Wed, Aug 12, 2020, 9:34am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Drumhead

"Yet I can recall not one lesson, not one instance, where a teacher told us that a German who did nothing to help Jews was committing "violence" on them."
There were more than enough European Jews who said that everybody in Germany who didn't help when they were literally annihilated was guilty.

"You say that taking down statues isn't a big deal and it's akin to mere "vandalism"."
I did not say that. I think that these Confederate statues should not have been erected in the first place and I'm not that rattled when they are brought down illegally but think that it should be done in a lawful way, for various reasons. Vandalism can be a misdemeanor offense or a felony, depending on the damage. so the people doing it illegally will probably be persecuted. Most of the stuff was filmed so that shouldn't be a problem.

" We again get back to the 800 lbs gorilla in the room - what *policy* are these people actually pursuing?"
Look up their internet page or maybe meet a few and talk about how for example that sign made you feel. Have you ever had an actual calm conversation with a BLM supporter?
Maybe do that first before you definitely conclude that these people want to harm you.

"Enough is enough with this Orwellian language butchering BS."
That sign really rattled you. A less emotional response seems appropriate.

"It is a message that says you can't be a bystander, you are either on our side or you're our enemy and will get what is coming to you."
you mean like this. And her it is not a few students holding up signs. Here it is a little more explicit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qdvm6h8WKg

I think we have gotten as far as possible. Meet these people, get first hand info or live in fear. Your choice.
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