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Tommy D.
Tue, Oct 20, 2020, 3:14am (UTC -5)
Re: Star Trek: Lower Decks

I think time, streaming services, and binge watching resulting in many repeated viewings have become very kind to a lot of Trek's mediocre and poor outings. Not that I think thats a bad thing in any way, but its just more of a personal observation when I read across different boards.
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Silly
Tue, Oct 20, 2020, 2:52am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S3: Evolution

The Beverly/Wesley stuff is soapy, but it is honest and earned (from a series point of view). Bev has been away and Wesley has worked his butt off. So Bevs swooping in and jumping on his ass is very real and also very wrong. Wesley made a serious mistake and is trying to fix it, and Bevs blows it off. And to be fair, she also corrects this.

Aside from the soap, unfortunately, this is a prime embarrassing example of the worst science in Star Trek being computer science. You put salt and pepper on an egg in ST and you’ve created an intelligent new life form that must be protected.
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Lodged Warpedo
Tue, Oct 20, 2020, 2:00am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You

Although too Star Warsy, this episode will always hold a very special place in my heart. Having been to a few of the locations (the crater in Myvatn MB lands on, the waterfall she fights from behind, & the Blue Lagoon where she gets healed) on Heim (Heimaey = Iceland), how could it not? I’m passionate about Iceland and passionate about Star Trek, & they managed to merge them into a beautiful premiere. And the emotions during the last scene was the cherry on top!

Yet I would be remiss on Jammer’s site to not be on blast about some things: 1,000 years is way too far into the future, hitting Book’s ship is ridiculous, the bug eating the prettier bug was right out of Return of the Jedi outside Jabba’s Palace, the non-stop fighting is too gratuitous (Michael punched Book for revenge no less than 3 times!), the worm engulfing Michael was too unnecessary and silly, and now that someone mentioned Mega Man blasters, that’s all I’ll ever see. Hate the Andorian prosthetics. I could go on.

But overall even though the writing is always the most lacking of all the critical components, episode 301 of DSC will always hold a very special place in my heart. I enjoyed the acting, the cinematography, the music (especially at the end), and I have hope for a decent season. But yeah to bring this full circle, the endless blasting, violence, Book being Force sensitive, and even the title of the episode “You Are That Hope” all feel way too much like SW for my ***ST***🖖

But
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Male
Tue, Oct 20, 2020, 1:12am (UTC -5)
Re: TOS S3: Turnabout Intruder

I think you might have missed the bit where Maracass said she was a woman.
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UK fan
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 10:12pm (UTC -5)
Re: TOS S3: Turnabout Intruder

@ Maracass

There is nothing in modern warfare which requires the biological traits men possess. Women are smaller targets who consume less rations and can fit more readily into smaller spaces within vehicles, again making them advantageous. Anyone can pull a trigger, anyone can aim, anyone can understand the machinery of modern warfare and follow orders.

On the other hand, if more women were in positions of power, worldwide, we'd probably have a lot less need for armies in the first place. You know, that whole preferring to have children and homes and stuff. And the lack of.. wait for it ... testosterone combined with toxic masculinity.

I say all that as a man, and no, not some "LOL, wimp beta male". My personality is as a leader of a pack, but not because of the dangly bits. I respect women - they have a lot more strength than idiots like you.
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Steve
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 9:11pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You

I liked it overall. Not the biggest fan of the new series', but at least this episode seeks to expand the lore and history of the universe it takes place in. Interesting to see a post-Federation galaxy, and the action was good, and the new character (i forget his name) was interesting enough.

Also thought the technology on show was a nice step up without it being totally ridiculous like it was in Picard.
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Jake
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 8:32pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S7: Lower Decks

I had the same thought about Ben when I first saw the show, but, for me, he does feel as fleshed-out as any other character. I also think it was smart to cast a fresh face - we’ve been watching Guinan for almost seven seasons, and we’ve seen her have a lot of discussions with senior officers (including altering an entire timeline). Having Ben takes that particular history off of the table, giving the viewer a new perspective on familiar and unfamiliar characters alike.

I do wish that Sito Jaxa had come to DS9, as was rumored for a long time. I would read a novel or watch a short about her in a heartbeat.
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MidshipmanNorris
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 8:03pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You

You know, I feel like I ought to confess something to everyone here who is railing at each new installment "not being like Star Trek" as it were; you may be surprised to learn that I felt this way about Star Trek: Voyager.

See, I'm noticing a running theme, that everyone seems to want to point to Trek 2009 as the "shark jump" point; I do not feel this way.

I started to get turned off, TV-wise, around the time Jadzia Dax was killed by Gul Dukat, and I didn't watch it when it aired on June 17, 1998... I was knee-deep in Final Fantasy VII by that point. Merely hearing about it from other fans (namely, my Dad) was enough for me to say "eh, I dunno if Star Trek is for me anymore." I think Voyager was already out, and I was kind of getting tired of Trek, Trek, Trek, Trek after Trek after Trek, here a Trek, there a Trek, UPN now is its own network, wowee zowee!!!

Every other show on UPN sucked hard. It was a transparent attempt to leverage advertising dollars away from the networks Paramount was beholden to because they thought Star Trek was so popular that people would be willing to watch their entourage of utter garbage shows, simply out of brand loyalty.

They had a fundamental misunderstanding about why Trek fans like Star Trek, in my opinion; it has good stories, that don't rely on cliches or 'easily-pandering-to-the-unwashed-masses' to get their point across. It pushes boundaries of social culture, and uses its stories to address issues which are present in our everyday lives.

In my teenage opinion, DS9 and Voyager were no longer doing that, and it took me years to realize that TNG had stopped doing it, years before it got canned.

The films "Generations" and "First Contact" were fairly good, but I felt like they made some rather questionable decisions, both in killing off James Kirk (some people were upset that he died the way he *did*, and I was upset that they felt like he should die, at all), and in introducing a "Borg Queen."

It seemed, to me, that these decisions were being made to put butts in seats, rather than to try to tell any kind of serious or impactful story.

Look, I don't really care if the phase inducers work the way Geordi said they did in Season 3, Episode 14 or whatever. I don't care if Starfleet's goals and principles remain the same from season to season, show to show. I don't care about any of that. I just wanna see a good story, about people traveling through space (as stated in the title). That's it. That's all. "Is the show any good?"

DS9 and Voyager, and the films, as they went on, began to be more about "events" that would make sure as many people watched them, and either paid the movie theater ticket price, or watched the absolutely horrendous advertising that has only gotten 10x worse as the years pass. Star Trek: Enterprise did much the same, focusing on "event plotlines" that were meant to sound good when told by word of mouth, just to hook you into watching whatever the writing room could agree to shoot this week.

I got tired of it.

Trek 2009, seemed like it would be a respite from all that. Maybe we could get back to telling stories about things, instead of having these "Event Plotlines" that seemed like transparent manipulations of word of mouth...

Then Star Trek: Into Darkness came out, and they played their cards so close to the gol-darned chest that I didn't realize until I was in the movie theater, and Benedict Cumberbatch was saying, "My name is Khan", that I'd been duped; it was another "Event Plotline" that was meant to generate word of mouth.

And that's all they seem to know how to do, anymore. "SOMETHING BIG IS ABOUT TO HAPPEN IN THE WORLD OF STAR TREK, MAKE SURE YOU TUNE IN."

Look, TV Producers, shut the fuck up.

A lot of shit, and I MEAN A LOT OF SHIT has already happened in the world of Star Trek.

I. Just. Want. To. Watch. A. Good. Show.

ST:DISCO Season 3 Ep 1 seems like it could be the building blocks of good shows. I hope this is the case.

Either you cook the stew properly, or it tastes like yesterday's socks.

WRITE. A. STORY.

Don't be stupid. Do your work.
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Tobias
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 5:52pm (UTC -5)
Re: DS9 S3: The Search, Part II

My take on the inclusion of Garak is that they figured out that nobody really knew what was going on with him, so they gave him such a big role to see if they could figure it out.

Also, this episode confirmed to me that KA Applegate (author of the Animorphs) was 100% a Trekkie. Symbiotic slugs, morphing into birds...
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Austin
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 5:22pm (UTC -5)
Re: PIC S1: Et in Arcadia Ego, Part 1

I was enjoying the show until this episode. So you’re telling me a group of humanoids, who possess superior intellect, speed and strength, are hunted down because they are feared, hide out with a crazy scientist who they view as their father(a Soong no less), who must inevitably turn on his own “child” when he finds out the leader is planning a mass extinction....

How is this not a complete rehashing of the Augments arc from ENT? They even made the same mistake as the Augments arc, namely they give the main character a personality, and all the rest they made mindless drones (one guy likes a soccer ball, cool).

It’s not that I didn’t like the Augments arc, it’s just I didn’t wait 30 years, sit through 8 episodes, and pay for CBS All Access to see it all over again.

1 star from me. Also Seven... women drivers ammiright? I’m just kidding but that’s how the show runners make it seem.
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Trent
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 5:21pm (UTC -5)
Re: DS9 S3: Equilibrium

I found this to be a watchable but ultimately mediocre episode.

Still, there are two great scenes here: Dax and Julian chatting in the cramped quarters of the Defiant, and the opening scenes in which the crew gather to eat with Sisko and Jake, Odo stirring a pot like a rubber-necked madman.

The Trill planet also had a nice aesthetic, with the slick, modern, above-ground facilities clashing with the more primitive, below-ground pools and caves. Yeah, it's a bit cheap looking, but it's a nice juxtaposition.

I feel the "Dax is possessed by a crazy past host" storyline was unnecessary. I'd rather a full episode dedicated to exploring the Trill homeworld, culture, and the ethical ramifications this episode skirts over: a Federation member planet lying to its populace.

Surely, upon learning that the Trill have been misleading everyone, Sisko should immediately contact an admiral and ask for orders. Should he expose the Trill lies? Should the Federation stay out of their affairs? IMO this sort of stuff is more interesting than the psychodrama the episode ultimately offered.
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Trent
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 5:03pm (UTC -5)
Re: DS9 S3: Family Business

Yanks said: "But what never seems to get mentioned is their treatment of women is pretty much Muslim. That has nothing to do with Capitalism."

That's not a "Muslim thing", though. All the major Abrahamic religions started out super sexist, women deemed inferior, required to be submissive, cover their faces or heads, barred from education, or owning property, or positions of power, or denied protection under religious law, or barred from positions of power within the religion itself.

And these religions would have all have stayed that way absent various outside pressures and social movements.

And sexism is intimately bound with capitalism. Anthropologists tell us early nomadic and hunter gatherer tribes tended to be fairly egalitarian and sexually equal. Then humans began to develop farming, settled down, started fighting over land, and started putting up fences. States were then formed to guarantee property rights and to guarantee that ruling classes could maintain their ownership of surplus through institutions that excluded other members of the community from political functions. They then set up armies, a judiciary power, and producers of ideology (scholars, teachers etc) who were to make sure that the domination of those who appropriated wealth was accepted by all.

Meanwhile, patrilinearity - the notion of inheritance and the transmission of property through the male line - meant that private property led to the importance of having male offspring whose lineage was beyond contest. Women thus became pieces of property themselves, something that had to be controlled and dominated in order to preserve one's property.

As societies developed, landed owners acquired public responsibilities and political functions which were denied to those they dispossessed. Women were excluded from these positions, and relegated to the private sphere, manual labor or child-bearing (the transmission of property, or the reproduction of the labor force etc).

So while sexism existed before capitalism, capitalism kickstarted whole new forms of sexism and control, and heightened many old forms.

Anyway, Jammer and most commenters seem to hate this episode, but I liked it a lot. William believes the Sisko/Jake/Kassidy plot is too cute and cloying, but I liked seeing Sisko caught off guard, and I think his first meeting with Kassidy is beautifully acted by Brooks. Yes, their last scene together in this episode is overly wacky, but that first meeting is something special.

Toraya and Elliot made a couple nice posts above. They basically criticize this episode for simplifying issues of sexism and turning female oppression into a cute thing rather than a brutish thing. Elliot goes on to say that this episode ignores the ways in which its view of emancipation ("Women can trade on Wall Street too!") still perpetuates oppression, or is itself oppression.

All of that is true IMO, and yet whenever I watch this episode, that's never the vibe I get from it. Quark's mom is a joke, yes, but the episode sympathizes with her plight, and plainly views Ferrengi culture as a horrible thing responsible for her oppression. And I think the intention of the episode is to portray “women's rights” as they would have occurred on Earth in the early 1900s, or late 1800s, when emancipation was equated with wearing pants, flappers, shorter skirts, working in factories and such. It's an incomplete emancipation, or a false one, but in the context of that kind of society – Ferengi women seem like a cross between Victorian era repression and something more Medieval – I feel it's the believable next step.

Personally, I'd rank this episode about 3 stars on Jammer's scale. I liked the architecture, the production design, the little stylized cash-registers the Ferrengi have everywhere, and the way the Ferrengi are constantly charging one another to use trivial things (the lift, a pad, a chair etc). The Mother/Rom stuff was a bit much, as was the Quark/Rom fight – there's about 10 minutes too much Ferrengi melodrama in this – and the episode does drop the ball in any number of philosophical/political ways, but I like it as a really weird bit of world-building. I like the gutsiness of diving into the Ferrengi, and the show's stubborn audacity to repeatedly churn out about 3 Ferrengi episodes a season.

Elliot is right, in that the episode is not rigorous enough – this a culture that should be awash in slavery and all manners of nastiness – but I can't imagine Ira Behr Trek doing that kind of stuff. I could see TOS geting away with it, maybe, but not DS9.
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SlackerInc
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 4:42pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You

@Ben, welcome!

@Mal, great post.

Those who are saying this is all total shite: I hear you, I acknowledge your criticisms have some validity, but this season just doesn't quite rub me the wrong way THAT badly just yet (and there were significant numbers of episodes in the first two seasons that definitely did). I'm cautiously non-pessimistic as of now, but we'll see.
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Trent
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 4:30pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You

Mal said: "Lorca was from the mirror universe. He wasn't looking for the best and the brightest."

lol. Disco was Lower Decks all along.
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Patrick D
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 3:32pm (UTC -5)
Re: Star Trek: Lower Decks

@Chrome

I never thought "Skin of Evil" was that bad an episode. In fact it was a pretty compelling story. Sure the ending with Tasha's funeral is maudlin, but it was otherwise pretty solid, though campy.

I agree with you though, season 1 of TNG is unfairly maligned for the most part. Episodes like "The Big Goodbye", "11001001", "Heart of Glory" and "Conspiracy" acquit it well. And there's a sense of wonderment in the first season of TNG that no other Trek series that came after can come close to touching.

Star Trek: Enterprise's first season was so appallingly mediocre and forgettable, that it was the first Star Trek series that I gave up on watching.
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Midw3sterner
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 12:52pm (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S5: 11:59

This might be the only episode of any television show where selling out your community to a big developer is presented as the right thing to do. The residents of this town seem to be putting all of their eggs in one basket and that is never a good thing: Detroit and the Auto Industry, Steel and Youngstown, Oil in Cleveland etc are obvious big examples but there are plenty of suburbs that have become ghettoes in the last 15 years because of the collapse of their local mall, and that’s what the Millenium Gate seems to be, a mall that looks like that ugly building down in St Louis.
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Chrome
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 9:03am (UTC -5)
Re: Star Trek: Lower Decks

@Startrekwatcher

Yeah, I think TNG has a pretty good first season as far as first seasons go for Star Trek. Even the "bad" episodes like "Justice" and "Skin of Evil" are iconic and memorable in their own right. The only downright bad episode is "Code of Honor", but it's infamy is more for aesthetic casting reasons whereas the story itself had an interesting ending that flipped the script on the classic Harem trope.

I can't really rank each series, though DS9 and TOS are remarkable for having some series highs in them. PIC was great in my opinion, but I get that it's also wildly different than other Trek shows.
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zanki
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 8:56am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You

"Does anyone remember when we used to be explorers?"

...me neither Jean-Luc.....me neither

as a whole this is the 180 degree turn star trek has taken since JJ Trek in 2009 and by extension his minion Kurtzman Trek (except for Beyond which I thought did a sincere effort to stay true to that theme, but I digress) .

One can argue DS9 had alot of pew pew and explosions .....but DS9 did take pause from that at times and reminded us we were watching Star Trek by showing us the human (or alien) nature of war and it's consequences. If I wanted non stop gun slinging action I'd probably watch the Mandelorian. At the end of the day the premise was practically a copie paste of the premise of a New Hope except Burnam meets the smuggler before entering a city that's seems like the Mos Eisley of said planet.....
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Yanks
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 7:40am (UTC -5)
Re: Star Trek: Lower Decks

I went back and took a look at my numbers and I need to change things a little but. DS9 had the worst rating average over the first season (I almost quit watching it). I haven't rated TNG or TAS yet.

S1's:
1. TOS
2. STLD
3. ENT
4. VOY
5. STD
6. TNG
7. PIC
8. DS9
9. TAS

It's interesting to see the diversity in opinion WRT to these season 1 rankings. I honestly wasn't expecting to see that much of a difference.
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Mal
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 6:45am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You

@John, lol! Love it!

Have you ever had your friends tells you - oh so proudly - how brilliant their kids are because they are amazing at using the iPad? I do everything I can to not laugh, cause you really should not make fun of your friends for being impressed with their kids' stupid shit.

Star Trek: Discovery strikes me as a future where all these people have super fancy 23rd century versions of iPad-like technology that allows people to do amazing things, even if they are only of average intelligence. That's why they are so fucking impressed with the power of math, people.

And I think that makes sense. Lorca was from the mirror universe. He wasn't looking for the best and the brightest. Quite the opposite. Anyone of decent intelligence might have seen through him. Discovered his secret. Just as Admiral Kat did the first time she visited the ship.

Nope, Lorca wanted cowards (ganglianic Saru), convicts (Michael), moral monsters Lieutenant Landry (I think someone once said that Rekha Sharma had the dubious distinction of playing someone awful in both universes. When you add in nBSG, you start to wonder about the actress herself...), naifs (the whole lot of the rest of the clueless bridge officers), and generally Lorca wanted total non-starfleet types (Stamets, Mr. "I used to do real research before Lorca and the war").

Is it any wonder that this motley crew is so ridiculously ill suited to the job. Lorca chose them. Their mediocrity is by design!

Data would take one look at these morons and request a transfer. Julian would be out of there faster than you can say preganglionic fibers. Harry Kim's mom would be so disappointed if this was the best posting he could get.

Friends don't let friends serve on Discovery.

That's what made the first episode pretty decent. The crew was nowhere to be seen. More like this, please.
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John
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 6:16am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You

It's more the manner in which Burnham reacts I found unrealistic. She emotionally breaks down when she's told the Federation is gone. But so what? If someone told a time traveler from the 1920s that the League of Nations didn't exist anymore, and they started bawling, they would look pretty foolish when subsequently told "...it's been replaced by the similar and mostly improved UN". At the very least you'd want to find a little more about the situation, wouldn't you?

It's the same feeling I had with ST: Picard's "fucking hubris" admiral and "I like science" Spock. Substituting rational explanations with drama in the belief that viewers are either no longer intellectually capable or are uninterested in the nerdy stuff.
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Neelix's spots
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 5:49am (UTC -5)
Re: Star Trek: Lower Decks

Okay, I'm going to give this ranking thing a go. I also thought ENT had a strong first season. It was later on I got bored with the Xindi and time travel stuff. And I absolutely loved VOY's first season, the potential was staggering and only when you think about how they wasted it does the show sink in my estimation.

1. VOY
2. DS9
3. ENT
4. TOS
5. TNG
6. LD
7. DIS
8. PIC

It's been way too long since i've seen TAS but I like the animation better than LD so I'd probably put it just below TNG.
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Startrekwatcher
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 5:35am (UTC -5)
Re: Star Trek: Lower Decks

To each their own.

I thought tos TNG and Ent had the most consistent and best first seasons. All three did a great job introducing their respective century and setting and introducing new races. The casts immediately clicked with me

Tos is a solid season but it is a tad uneven. Some good episodes and some not so good episodes

I like TNG best cause I enjoyed more episodes, the sense of awe and wonder, the action adventure mixed with high concept sci fi

I enjoyed Naked Now, Datalore , when the bough breaks, last outpost, where no one has gone before, the neutral zone, conspiracy, heart of glory, coming of age, 1100101. Even the lesser episodes I find watchable even code of honor. The only true weak episodes I thought there were big goodbye and we will always have paris bI won’t go into why I like these episodes. I commented in detail why in their respective episode threads

For all the bashing ENT takes I find it had the right idea and tone in season one. And more of a confidence in what it was doing than voyager or DS9 or Kurtzman “trek”. It told simple standalone stories from the perspective of a novice crew experiencing what other crews saw as commonplace. The stories were simple. Some recycled. But held my attention and were entertaining—broken bow, fight or flight, Andorian incident, civilization, breaking the ice, cold fromt, fortunate son, dear doctor, shuttlepod one, detained, acquisition, fallen hero. I appreciated that things were small and intimate. The most epic it got was with the Temporal Cold War. While TcW would lose its center here it was at its most eerie and intriguing. I think of they kept doing this in season two but punched up the plot and introduced more ToS aliens even as just aliens of the week like on TNG it wouldn’t have gone off the rails as it did

Up until discovery and PIC I thought ds9 was worst freshman season Ds9 relied way too much on TNG speaking as a TNG fan. A lot of stories were awful and could barely sit through—the storyteller, the forsaken, battle lines, of wishes were horses, q-less, move along home, personae etc

I do finding myself enjoying it more now than originally and in retrospective its first season truly felt faithful to the idea of an outpost on the unexplored wild frontier. After the first season it felt like Ds9 was in the middle of well explored space surrounded by well knowns. It did have some good standalones in the vein of TNG—the passengee, Babel, a man alone, past prologue, dax, vortex, and its season finale was strong and made the bajorans and prophets very mysterious and alien. Sadly as the series went on that mystique was lost which was a disappointment

Voyager was mediocre. It had an excellent pilot. One of the best trek episodes ever. But then that sense of wonder and strangeness was rarely experienced rest of the season. Lot of mediocre episodes like the cloud, Jetrel, learning curve to name a few. I will say the ensemble and the characters were at their best here before everyone but janeway seven and the Doctor had their characters assassinated or reduce to cyphers

There were some good episodes like the phage, time and again, state of flux,, faces. And I thought the Vidiians was one of the best new trek races conceived. But in season ones favor, due to Michael
Piller being involved it and season two felt the most trek like of voyagers seasons which was a good thing even of writing hit or miss

Discovery was just a hot mess. Unlikeable characters, convoluted storyline, dramatically flaccid klingon war. Mediocre payoff

Picard started out with some promise but by the end all the good elements introduced in the beginning were squandered in such a criminal fashion, the Borg, a possible tie between Borg origin and Romulans, Seven of Nine. Hugh treated like a plot device unceremoniously killed off by the demands of needing a shocking demise. An abrupt and underwhelming season finale which couldn’t make up its mind whether it wanted to say something about the essential ness of mortality and dying via Data’s death scene only to be undermined by a most un Picard like decision to chest death in an artificial body. Totally gutting whatever point the writers were trying to make as well as wasting what could have been a series spanning arc surrounding Picard’s final days years and saying goodbye to those in his life along the way ievTNG cameos
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Booming
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 5:22am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You

@Mal
" I mean I get it, if some guy from a thousand years ago popped up today and found out that the Ottoman Empire didn’t exist anymore, I can see him being a little disoriented."
Certainly, considering the Ottoman Empire didn't exist 1000 years ago. :)
The (Eastern) Roman Empire was at it's last peak at that time because of the Macedonian Restoration.

"But it is a freaking thousand years. Why and how could you ever logically expect it to still exist."
The Roman Empire (including the the Republic) lasted for almost 2000 years and was the most powerful state in the region for 1200 of those, if you include the Holy Roman Empire than you can add a few more centuries. China exists for more than 2000 years and counting, sure it broke up a few times but even then the smaller states saw themselves as China trying to unify it again which one of them eventually did.

I get your sentiment though. Starfleet officers were always portrayed as reasonable/rational. Being overwhelmed by the news like her is just stupid emotional button pushing NuTrek is so famous for.

"But I think it is worth giving Discovery Season 3 the benefit of the doubt"
Why?? At some point CBS noticed that the Transformers movies made more money than the TNG movies so they hired the guy who wrote the Transformers movies aka Kurtzman. You don't hire the movie garbage man to create a five star menu, you hire him for garbage. I watch this not as Star Trek, I watch it like an ongoing car crash, how something I sometimes valued quite a bit is slowly disintegrated by our capitalistic overlords. I'm also amused by people defending this. Even at his lowest 25% of the American electorate supported Nixon. There are always people defending something no matter what.

"Even in the darkest hour, Aditya Sahil went through the motions. Every single day. Because his Flag still stood for everything he believed in."
That guy is actually the dumbest part. Instead of doing something he was literally just waiting for a miracle to happen. A starfleet officer should be out there helping, not sitting behind a desk doing absolutely nothing because his daddy told him to.

I'm really interested were this will go.

Get yourself some ethanol and enjoy the ride.
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Jillyenator
Mon, Oct 19, 2020, 12:38am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S1: Angel One

This one never bothered me. In the 80s I found it unusual and interesting. As of tonight's viewing, I wasn't offended either. It held my attention and had some good moments with the regular cast.

Trio and Yar cracking up after Riker said he was comfortable
in his new "clothes" and swept out had me smiling. I backed it up to see it again and I think it's actually Sirtis and Crosby laughing it up. It looked so natural and good natured. Their characters can be reserved, so I enjoyed their light interaction.

More good bits with Geordi, Worf, Data, Riker, Crusher, and Picard (being too sick to function and hating it, which also made me smile). So that's 8 of the 9 main cast members having at least one shiny moment in a rare full use of the ensemble.

It's episodes like The Outrageous Okona which bore and confuse me, like accidentally stepping into someone's else's failed backdoor pilot. Angel One is no gem, but it's not boring.
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