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Jason R.
Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 5:22am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You, Part 1

"Damn, things are really heating up in the nerdiest, most inconsequential comment section on the entire internet."

This should be Jammer's tagline for the website.

This place is such a delightful throwback. I hope it never changes.
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Saphthings
Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 4:40am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You, Part 1

This episode deserves a minimum of 3 stars. It was really good Trek. Finally.

It was in the future. Finally.

But mostly the acting and worldbuilding was amazing. We got technobabble, a space druid, award winning acting for Michael, super acting for Book. We got surprises and advanced tech.

I've really detested Battlestar Discovery for season 1, and was barely ok with Season 2, but God am I glad I stuck around because this was amazing and one of the first times I truly teared up in Star Trek.

I think many of us look back at Star Trek with Nostalgia filled Rose tinted glasses. I'm rewatching TNG for the second time now and am near the end of Season 2.... So far I'm almost 50 episodes in. FIFTY. And it's been mostly garbage. Other than a few highlights like Measure of Man and etc it's so bad. I just keep reminding myself that eventually I apparently love it for some reason.

Now we essentially have 1 seasons worth of Discovery, since they have less episodes, and... It's given me way more than TNG and several of the classics...

Yes it's a bit more of a physical series than we're used to, but watching TNG now the sexism and some racist things aged SO bad... It's been 30 years from then! It wasn't going to stay the "same" and "the same" isn't quite as stellar as we remember it being.

I'd rate this episode a 4/4. And I honestly am surprised at some 3s people have given to prior series and then say this is a 2...

The only reason why it might be a 3/4 is the camerawork. It's like a new graduate just came off of film school and thinks Dutch angles and "edgy" fast shots is cool and innovative. Constant flash flash flash back and forth and tilted angles to be I don't know what. At some point I almost need a stabilized version to actually see some things...
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Tomalak
Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 4:16am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: Far From Home

LW, I find Tilly's weight gain very striking so I observed it, yeah. It's not a criticism because some people do get way fatter over time - so I don't think you can call it a plot hole or something. I sense that you think it's off bounds even to talk about this on a message board but you can't quite explain why?
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Wesley's pyjamas
Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 3:39am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: Far From Home

Did anyone catch what the purpose of using the phaser during the crash was meant to be? I think Saru said something about cushioning the impact, but how would that work? It couldn't be by applying inverse force to the ship, because that would mean anytime a phaser is fired the person or ship would be propelled backward. The only other thing I can think of is melting the ice.
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Tommy D.
Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 2:58am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You, Part 1

@Glom

I agree, especially on Galaxy. I think there definitely could have been some more attention in certain spots, and the ability to use the GameCube controller in Sunshine for the analog triggers would have been nice as well. Overall though, as a collection, I like the games to play as closely to the original as possible. I think if it had remaster in the title I would more critical of the lack of QoL additions.

Someone had mentioned FFVII earlier. I wonder how they felt about that remake? I know this is a Trek forum but the similarities in opinions on classic/remake video games and classic trek/modern trek have so many parallels.
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Glom
Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 2:14am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You, Part 1

@Tommy D.

I'm not one of those whose really salty about it. Let's be honest, a full grounds up remake of 64 would be its own release, not part of a collection. And at this point, I think Nintendo would consider the low poly look to be too iconic to change. Comparisons to Super Mario All-Stars miss out that it was released before the 8 bit look became something iconic. If that game was never made, I doubt that any graphical overhauls of the NES games would exist, especially for the first. It would be considered blasphemous or cultural vandalism.

That being said, the only partial upscaling of 64, leaving some really noticeable bad textures in such as the wall mounted signs, the lack of options for the camera axis, the fact that it only arbitrarily picks some guys for the All-Stars collection, that all makes it feel very much do minimum.

Though the Galaxy port is great. I LOVE the gyro cursor. Much prefer it to the pointer because I can rest my hand how I want and it is has just the right sensitivity. Also, mapping the spin attack to the Y button is awesome too.
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Lodged Warpedo
Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 1:47am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: Far From Home

@Tomalak

No, Tilly is not at all unrecognizable. And what a very weird thing to comment on. If you say it’s not a criticism, then what exactly would you call it? Just an observation? You really couldn’t bring anything better to the table? Guess not.
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Dick
Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 1:26am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: Far From Home

After last week's off-format premiere, this felt like a return to the usual STD fare. Frenetic, over the top action, gratuitous profanity and gore, and a crew full of snarky, unlikeable characters (Saru excepted).

I was done with Evil Georgiou in Season 1, and it's distressing how big of a role she continues to play in this series. I've seen her described as a "fan-favorite", but the character is just awful: a one-dimensional comic book villain who is totally unsuitable as a member of a Starfleet crew.

I continue to be confused by the personal transporter technology featured in Season 3. Saru, Tilly, and Georgiou use it to transport directly from the Western bar to the Discovery. So why didn't Evil Dude just beam directly onto the ailing Discovery with his posse, shoot everyone, and steal the dilithium? Or was that the plan all along and they were just messing with Saru and Tilly?

I am slightly intrigued by Detmer's condition (she is one of the more likable characters). Is it just a concussion or PTSD? I can't believe that they'd rehash the Airiam plotline and have Detmer infected with Control, too. Okay, I can believe it.

I liked the reveal that Michael has been stranded for a year before Discovery arrived through the wormhole. Should be interesting to learn what she's been up to. (Book must have used his nanotech to create some hair extensions for her new do.)

Stray thoughts:

* It's pretty impressive that the Discovery and its crew managed to remain intact when it crashed into the glacier. The last time we saw a starship crash into an icy planet ("Timeless" (VOY)) everyone on board died in the impact!

* Why doesn't Saru immediately place Georgiou in the brig once the Discovery crash lands? There's no reason why this evil and manipulative character should be given free reign of the ship now that Section 31 is no longer around to protect her.

* The Evil Dude in the Western bar (didn't catch his name) claims that The Burn is the best thing that ever happened to him. So is he supposed to be over 100 years old? There's no reason why he couldn't be, but he sure doesn't look it.
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Mal
Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 12:57am (UTC -5)
Re: TOS S1: The Enemy Within

The Enemy Within
Star Trek season 1 episode 5

"The impostor had some interesting qualities, wouldn't you say, Yeoman?”

- Spock.

3 Stars (out of 4)

Spock’s last line is shocking.

As my namesake Mal might ask, “define interesting.”

As Wash might respond, “Oh God, Oh God, we’re all going to die?”

https://youtu.be/PBEUQSpRvSI

I’m amazed at how clearly TOS was able - in just 5 episodes - to create a very clear arc for the series that actually takes us forward for decades. As I mentioned in my review of The Man Trap, Spock is emotionally stunted and leans heavily on logic. His failure to even react to news of the death of a crew mate in The Man Trap is an absolute shock to Uhura. It might have been logical. But shocking. On the opposite side, Kirk has to berate Bones in sickbay for being equally unmindful about the cause of death of that crewman - so caught up is Bones in his own infatuation with his ex-girlfriend.

Both Spock’s lack of emotion, and Bones’ excessive emotion are liabilities. And Kirk relies on both of them to give him some balance.

In my review of Where no One has Gone before, I point out that once again Kirk needs Spock to be a heartless bastard. That doesn’t mean that Kirk will follow Spock’s advice (he does not kill Gary Mitchell when Spock tells him to, only later when he has no choice). But it does mean that Kirk finds Spock’s perspective valuable in coming to his own independent conclusion.

And now here with The Enemy Within, we have the natural progression of that Spock/logic versus Bones/feelings dichotomy, with an actual split in Kirk himself.

Kirk’s two sides, passion and calculation, are split in two, and neither can do its job without the other. Kirk is a great captain, yes. But he is great because he can be sympathetic to Spock’s heartless logic and sympathetic to Bones’ emotional excesses. Kirk contains both sides.

There is line from an old poem by Whitman: I am large. I contain multitudes. A Nobel laureate recently put similar thoughts to music: https://youtu.be/pgEP8teNXwY A key line: I fuss with my hair, and I fight blood feuds. I contain multitudes.

@Linda asks about makeup. Well, the man fusses with his hair, and fights blood feuds. He contains multitudes.

I completely respect @Richard’s reading of Whitney’s book. But I find myself with a very different take-away from her book than @Richard does.

In those pages, Whitney is talking about the dark side and the light side, and bringing balance. She says,

“This is also the the concept behind the ‘good side’ and the ‘dark side’ of The Force in Star Wars. The message of ‘The Enemy Within’ is that by managing our passions, character defects, and emotions with reason and logic, we can be whole and well-balanced as human beings. The flesh always wars against the spirit - and when the spiritual aspect of Kirk is stripped away, the raw pulsating flesh reigns supreme in the evil Kirk’s body.”

That strikes me as completely accurate. Remember, even Star Wars was not about defeating the dark side. It was about bringing balance to The Force. Balance.

That’s what makes this 5 episode arc so incredible. With The Man Trap, Bones was literally at the mercy of flesh. In Where no Man has Gone Before, in advising Kirk to kill Gary before it was absolutely necessary, Spock is at the mercy of logic. Kirk brings a great spiritual balance to these two sides of human nature.

"Of all the souls I have encountered in my travels, his was the most human.” Spock embodied both sides of humanity: logic and passion. Most of the time logic prevailed. Sometimes, like in the incredible scene in The Naked Time, he breaks down crying as passion bursts through. It is only Kirk that is well balanced as between Spock and Bones. That’s why Kirk sits in the Captain’s chair.
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Mertov
Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 12:08am (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You, Part 1

Booming:
"One more thing Booming... I don't start watching a Star Trek show with a pre-disposed hatred of a writer or a showrunner."
I don't think many people actually hate Discovery.

My quote above is not related to do your reply, but yes, I agree with that. I believe most people give shows a fair try and decide they like it or not. My comment was related to how one feels about a showrunner not the show itself.

On a separate note, I saw the Ready Room with Wil Wheaton who had David Ajala as his guest. Great interview, Ajala expressed his excitement for becoming a part of Trek universe (apparently he is friends with Patrick Stewart and worked with him in the Royal Shakespeare Company). He talked about how he got offered the job after a reading and was on his way to Iceland 8 days later, without having had time to do a chemistry read with Martin-Green, which makes it that much more impressive in my view that the synergy between the two was one of the strong parts of the episode. Ajala praised Martin-Green for being wonderful to work with and being so welcoming to a newcomer (which every cast member has said in the past for her too).
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GreenBoots_
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 10:55pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You, Part 1

Damn, things are really heating up in the nerdiest, most inconsequential comment section on the entire internet.
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Rahul
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 10:36pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: Far From Home

Definitely stronger than last week's episode -- just felt more "realistic" (within the Star Trek paradigm) and what I really liked was Saru holding true to Federation ideals, taking charge as a captain and showing leadership and resolve. I think the way Saru was written doing these things was much better than, say, Janeway in a number of VOY episodes.

It's a fairly simple story but I liked how effectively it was conveyed. Again, the visuals are incredible and the whole ship crashing scene at the start of the episode appeared more realistic and gritty than anything from classic Trek -- guess there can be improvements over 20+ years.

Only one part really pissed me off -- when Georgiou shows up and kicks ass after getting phasered multiple times. Give me a break. Some baddie's 32nd century weapon doesn't totally fry her like Kal was fried earlier??

I'm not a big fan of the cast and crew of Discovery but at least this episode allowed us to catch up on all the important ones -- and we can see their unique characteristics; however, all those characteristics are dialled up to 11, which is excessive. Tilly -- again excessively ditsy, Reno excessively snarky, Nhan excessively useless, for example. But I found Reno this time to be more tolerable -- in a way, she's like McCoy on steroids with the snark. Not sure what's up with Detmer -- impressive how she is thrown over her console during the crash.

I liked how Saru dealt with Georgiou in a number of scenes. He was the star of the episode and I liked it much more because the whole thing didn't revolve around Burnham. I am not a fan of the Burnham character, nor am I a fan of SMG's acting. The writers have gone too far with trying to make Burnham the protagonist.

The premise here is decent. That dilithium is some valuable commodity in this post-apocalyptic world with ex-members of the Federation (Tellarites, Andorians, Coridans etc.) seemingly in little factions after "The Burn". Also, interesting that Burnham has been in this time a year already...

Good enough for 3 stars for "Far From Home" -- plenty to like here (the exceptional visuals most notably). Held my interest consistently, unlike "That Hope Is You, Part 1", which bothered me for stretches. Look forward to seeing a replay of this one -- could not say the same for last week's outing. I think DSC needs to get the viewer to appreciate its main cast some more and this outing should do that. Nothing excessively stupid -- just an overall solid outing.
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GreenBoots_
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 10:35pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: Far From Home

I think this episode cements the idea that Burnham is by far the worst aspect of Discovery for me. No weepy monologues about vague ephemeral concepts means a solid hour of tension, character beats, and some decent action- a roomful of people with a handful of guns will always be 1000x more intense than a billion space ships pew-pewing at each other in the vacuum of space, no matter how many secondary characters you send careening over the control panels. The guy playing the villain was quite good, I thought, and brought some weight to those scenes they would've otherwise lacked. Not that this episode was perfect, I felt the Stamets-Reno B-plot was pretty perfunctory, some pacing issues, and the needless drudging up of plotlines from season 2 was eyeroll inducing. It's still not what I consider good Star Trek, it's still missing that je ne sais quoi, but between the bar scenes and the crew pulling together to manage a crisis in a way that felt semi-professional, I actually enjoyed this one a decent amount as just an hour of scifi television. 3 stars.
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Peremensoe
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 10:14pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: Far From Home

@Name

It is two separate episodes. This was not "That Hope is You, Part 2," about Burnham's intervening year.
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Tomalak
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 9:47pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: Far From Home

Tilly is almost unrecognisable now given how much weight she has gained since season 1. That's not a criticism - no reason people in the future wouldn't struggle with their weight. But it's almost like the difference between Scotty in the Original Series and Scotty in the later films - and it's not exactly been twenty years.
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Tommy D.
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 9:41pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You, Part 1

@Glom

"In a way it is the opposite situation to Super Mario 3D All-Stars. That is a minimum effort product but it has three of the greatest games ever so it will sell like mad as it has done"

I actually prefer the light touch they gave that set. The original games themselves would probably set you back close $100 still, and thats if you still have working consoles. But I do understand people wanting a little more bang for their buck.
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Maya
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 8:31pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: Far From Home

I liked it better than last week`s episode. The western-ish style was quite well employed and I got to see my girl Tilly, so I was happy
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Tommy D.
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 8:22pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: Far From Home

Because I'm 100% sure people will still be watching "The Wire" in 3188, shotguns will persevere. Even space cowboys are going to want to be Omar.

For "Far from Home", I would say probably another 2.5 star outing. I thought the opening crash was well done, and the once again the filming location for the miners camp was spectacular. The saloon scene seemed to carry on a bit long, but I thought the programmable matter was neat. I think it was fun to see all the characters on the ship interact and have something meaningful to do to get Discovery back up, but as a whole I think the episode was just okay.
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Gail NYC
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 7:36pm (UTC -5)
Re: ENT S3: The Council

Agree with whoever said that the Sphere Builders look like Odo's relatives. They have that spooky not-really-there aura of the gods.
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MidshipmanNorris
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 7:04pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You, Part 1

... Geez.

I came to read this review, only to suddenly realize I'd already read it yesterday... I guess I was so drunk that I was blacked out while reading it (my birthday is tomorrow but I'm scheduled to work, so I decided to "celebrate" yesterday), but I distinctly remember the review. My comment of 12:09pm Wednesday was mostly legible too.

I must be getting old. I really didn't think I'd had that much to drink.
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Mike
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 6:51pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You, Part 1

Is there such thing as a (factually) good writer? I know people who dislike Tolstoy, Shakespeare. What use is it telling these people that these writers are "good"?
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Booming
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 6:47pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You, Part 1

@ James
I wanted to see what they do with the new setting. Maybe I jump ship halfway through. The first episode was sadly a disappointment. It wasn't terrible just underwhelming.
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Joseph S.
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 6:35pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You, Part 1

Fair enough, I liked Star Trek 2009 better than The Big Lebowski too.
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James White
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 6:32pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You, Part 1

If you know the show will suck, yet for some insane reason you keep watching it, then you will get more of the same. Have fun.
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Booming
Thu, Oct 22, 2020, 6:21pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S3: That Hope Is You, Part 1

@Mertov
Never seen fringe but I always thought that this was more an Abrams show. I also thought that STar Trek 2009 was enjoyable but I wouldn't call it good again an Abrams collaboration.
I think he has written quite a few terrible movies, more than good ones. There is a reason that he called the poor mans JJ Abrams.

"One more thing Booming... I don't start watching a Star Trek show with a pre-disposed hatred of a writer or a showrunner."
I don't think many people actually hate Discovery. It is too generic for that in my opinion. I only hated one movie "American Sniper" but I severely disliked Star Trek Picard, far more than Discovery which in season 2 had a few good episodes.

@Joseph
"Kurtzman only has writing credit for one episode of Discovery, so this argument is pretttttty dumb."
No that statement is. Read up on the subject of how he interferes with most aspects of the show to understand what I mean.

"Few Trek movies have aggregate approval close to Kurtzman’s - “The Wrath of Khan” with an 88% and “Star Trek: First Contact” with a 92%."
Sure Star Trek 2009 (94%) is clearly the best Trek movie (according to the rotten score), far better than Wrath of Khan(88%) and the loser movies the voyage home and the undiscovered country with 81% and 82%.

"Star Trek” (2009) was written by Kurtzman and was critically acclaimed"
So true. It won an Oscar and was nominated for three more (Sound, Sound editing, Visual effects)

Kurtzman won that Oscar almost alone, it was for make up.

"TLDR: Yeah, well, that’s just, like your opinion, man."
Are you really throwing a Dude quote at me while defending Kurtzman. The Coen brothers are actual artists who often create great movies. By the way, the Rotten Score of the Big Lebowski is 83%.
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