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Mon, Feb 12, 2018, 8:43pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: Will You Take My Hand?

On a previous Discovery:

Lorca: You're the most important being in either the P.U. or the M.U. so even though I could have been emperor, I'll die because well, Georgiou is more important to you than me (sniffle!) and I must die.

**music plays**

On the finale:

Georgiou M.U. I guess I won't shoot you because you're Burnham and Burnham is awesome. But later, girl. Worlds to conquer, you know.

L'Rell: God, I hate humans, minus Vok/Ash, but since you're Burnham and you're fucking awesome for a small human, I'll take your bomb and get my bros to call back their ships so Earth and other places aren't destroyed and you get to be the heroine.

Ash: You're too awesome for me so of course I'll take L'Rell as second choice. Don't tell her she's second. She'll kick my beta ass to Rura Penthe!

Cornwell/Starfleet: Even though you threatened to mutiny again, and fucked up by bringing Georgiou M.U. here, you magically ended the war so me and my Starfleet Admirals bros are gonna give you some ego-boo, medals, your rank back, and we'll let you lecture us all on what genocidal fucktards we were.

Sarek: I'm closer to you than my wife (shh, don't tell her about the magic katra across the miles connection bit) and I agree with Cornwell. We were genocidal maniacs and you were absolutely brilliant solving what 90 gazillion other Starfleeters couldn't solve, some I'm a gonna give you a SMILE! Let's go give Spock the bad news that you're my new favorite child!

**Pike sends distress call**

Pike: That'll get the awesome Burnham here. I'm dying to meet the superstar of two universes!

Spock: Oh God. I think I'll take shore leave to Rura Penthe instead.


P.S. Tilly is a moron. She should have been on some Orion ship en route to Orion and the slave market. What a dumbass.

* *
"Garak could have solved this whole season's problems while hemming a dress."

ROFLMAO! No kidding. I can just picture it.

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Mon, Feb 5, 2018, 2:28am (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: The War Without, The War Within

@JP Saru said Ash was limited to certain areas and they even put the equivalent of an ankle bracelet on his wrist. As for secret messages, he is likely locked out of the comms and any codes he had as security chief are terminated.
Sure, he is freer than maybe he should have been, but it wasn't total freedom. Also, presumably this Dr. Pollard (was that the woman Saru talked to about Ash's condition?) signed off on it.
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Sun, Feb 4, 2018, 11:14pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: The War Without, The War Within

Really enjoyed this one, but a slightly lower score (if I were to give one) than the last three.

That Ash/Michael scene just made the episode screech to a halt. SOOO boring and overlong. Glad the episode was nearly 50 minutes, but I'd have taken a couple minutes out of that scene.

Yeoh is knocking it out of the park. Great scenes with Michael, Cornwell, and Sarek.

Loved the Ash in the mess hall scene. Tilly showing a lot of compassion (very Star Trek), and others quick to follow her lead.

Cornwell is still a little dry for me. If she wasn't this way before the nine months passed, I could contribute it to how rough the war has been, but instead the actor seems to just be very stilted. I have read she is good in other stuff. Not sure if it is the writing here.

Hard to see how we wrap up the war in just another 50ish minutes (any chance it is an extended finale a la Doctor Who?).
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Mon, Jan 29, 2018, 7:40pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: What's Past Is Prologue

On Burnham saving MGeorgiou: It was clearly an emotional, impulsive decision. She didn't want to watch her die "again."

For those who decry this move because MG is a terrible person, are you the same ones that decried Lorca leaving Mudd in the Klingon prison?

Is Mudd worth saving despite his questionable ethics simply because he is a Fed citizen but MG is not because she is a Terran?

Mudd was not left to certain death (esp. considering he got free soon after), but MG was as good as dead.

Isn't the whole point of Burnham's "I'm not going to kill you" to Lorca about the Federation being more ethical than that?

Isn't the ethics of the situation independent of consequences after? MG might be jailed or kept under lockdown in the PU, but it doesn't really matter to the decision to save her.

In the moment, was Burnham supposed to let her die?
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Mon, Jan 29, 2018, 12:05am (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: What's Past Is Prologue

Absolutely thrilling. Edge of your seat stuff. Also the first episode that nearly brought me to tears. Great stuff.

Seems like they are in for a rude awakening back in the PU. Not just the nine months, but Starfleet (Cornwall/Sarek and others from the preview clip) seem paranoid and pissed. Maybe they figured out about Lorca?

OF COURSE: It probably doesn't help that the ship still says ISS DISCOVERY on it... (gonna need to undone that paint job)
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Sun, Jan 28, 2018, 8:52pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: What's Past Is Prologue

Anyone see the preview? Did the MU resistance cell get accidentally transported to the Prime Universe?
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Sun, Jan 28, 2018, 8:43pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: What's Past Is Prologue

" I'm hoping it's not as simple as Lorca Is Actually Evil."

Yeah, well, about that. :/ I was so hoping this was wrong but after last week, there was no doubt.

Very disappointed. Instead of an interesting Prime U. troubled/PTSD Captain, we get a cartoon character villain. *snore*

I could not care less about the stupid Klingon war. And MU Georgiou in the Prime Universe. Yeah, she won't last long.

The only interesting thing left is that little green spore that burrowed into Tilly.
Burnham will, of course, get some pips.
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Wed, Jan 24, 2018, 10:52am (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: Vaulting Ambition

This may have been addressed upthread, so apologies if so.

I realized something rewatching the scene with the Stametses. When the camera zooms in on the screen showing “ISS Charon,” rather than being about the Stametses switching places, which they did not, I think the emphasis is meant to show that MU Stamets isn’t on MU Discovery, but rather on the palace ship.

Given we have not seen MU Discovery, we might wonder why it must look identical to the revised PU Discovery (as we know the ruse of changing unis and the ship lettering, etc. seemed to work).

If the spore tech is not functional (as MU Stamets got caught in the network – we don’t know the whole story yet), but is on the Charon, why does the MU Discovery look like the PU Discovery, as it was built for the spore tech? Is there a MU Glenn too?
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Sun, Jan 21, 2018, 8:47pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: Vaulting Ambition

oh, I also liked the Stamets stuff. Culber wasn't probably necessary, though it was a decent way to get PU Stamets to listen/wake up. Have we seen the last of MU Stamets? I am guessing not...
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Sun, Jan 21, 2018, 8:45pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: Vaulting Ambition

Stellar episode again. MU is brutal as fuck. Yeoh was intense.

A little disappointed MU Lorca is confirmed. Guess that means he is out for Season 2. The reveal was really well done though. (He let that guy die!) Note that when he said "someone better came along" he meant MU Burnham (and maybe to a small degree PU Burnham, depending on his timeline between Buran and PU Discovery).

Will we find out how he got to the PU?

The Lorca reveal does bring me to my first bigger criticism so far. With both the Lorca and Voq/Ash reveals, DSC has undercut an otherwise interesting character. Ash had PTSD (and I guess Voq as Ash did too), but the reveal sort of guts that (no pun intended). Then, Lorca seems to be a damaged soul (partly due to losing the Buran), and now that he is officially a MU asshole, his seeming growth and struggle has all just been a long con (though he probably does regret losing the Buran - or does he?). I am enjoying what they did do, but I just wanted to point this issue out.

I enjoyed Tilly (she didn't do much this time). Saru was very good (both overall and especially in the L'Rell scenes).

Also a shame it was only 37 minutes. Shortest episode yet. Only THREE left...
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Sun, Jan 21, 2018, 12:20pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: The Wolf Inside

I really don't understand the confusion about Discovery picking up Tyler. Burnham's earlier conversation with Tilly/Prime Saru clearly showed she had a communication line open with them. Furthermore, Lorca told the Discovery to say close (to the Shenzhou) before he and Burnham parted in the previous episode.

Sure, they could have showed Burnham calling Prime Saru back and hatching the plan, but that would have completely killed the drama of the scene of Tyler being beamed off and "saved."
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Tue, Jan 16, 2018, 2:54pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: The Wolf Inside

@Kuebel Tyler/Voq said "she should have let me die" because it would have been an honorable death (versus being imprisoned).

A bit about the episode and the show as a whole:

I thought the episode was great (as was Despite Yourself). I was on the edge of my seat for most of it (save for the beginning monologue and Tyler/Burnham scene).

I enjoyed Tilly trying to science Stamets back to reality. Her trying to do so was no crazier than every time any main cast member on any Trek risked their life or others on some crazy scheme to solve the problem of the week. So she is a cadet? So what? She is obviously trained in science and understood the spores better than most. There probably should have been medical staff on hand, but Saru letting her try was not an issue for me.

I never thought Burnham/Ash had much chemistry, so I don't care that that relationship is over. I thought SMG played the betrayal well and Latif was masterful as Voq began to break through. When he went into Klingon mode, I had goosebumps!

I think most people are too harsh on Burnham. Aside from the mutiny (a mark on her record for sure), she hasn't really done anything particularly immoral (and the state of the mutiny is debatable to a degree - probably more arrogant or misguided than immoral). Her killing Connor in the MU was pure self-defense, so critics that point to that didn't seem to pay proper attention to that scene or its context.

Lorca seems to be the biggest (Tyler/Voq murder aside) problem morally. I am not sure whether his win-at-all-costs is purely because he lost the Buran or whether he in part lost it because of that attitude in the first place (he did say he destroyed it to spare his crew - ?!). I am not on the Lorca is really a MU guy train, and I don't really want that to be the case. It would ruin his development, unless they pull it off in a heretofore unseen way. I like his redemption arc, and I think that there is more to the Buran story we haven't learned yet.

Overall stuff:

I love this show. I look forward to it more than most of the shows I watch. I really do not understand most of the criticism from people here and on other Trek boards.

I am not here to tell others to enjoy the show. Everyone likes different things. For those with continuity (mostly visual) or serialization/theme issues or other gripes, I am sorry the show isn't what you wanted or thought it would/could/should be.

I enjoy the serial nature (my favorite Trek is DS9, though I like most of Trek), and it has been great to see what Trek can be in that format.

I don't find the writing/dialogue to be poor (especially after the first couple episodes, which were the weakest in that regard). I like the characters just fine. Some more than others, but I don't dislike anyone.

I find it sort of humorous that some of the same people who cry foul that the so-called twists are too "shocking" also claim that the same twists are "predictable." Can you be shocked by predictable things? Can I be shocked the sun came up today? I guess if you think the writers think they are being shocking, then they might fall short...

The Ash/Voq reveal was very well done, but unfortunately, it was discussed so heavily here and other Trek places, it was never going to be what they hoped. It was hindered by Latif being first announced as playing a Klingon, which they retracted. The fictional actor listed as playing Voq also hurt things. I also think the weekly release format leaves too much time in this current internet/social media culture to really lay groundwork for longer plots/reveals. Everyone is discussing theories to death.

If DSC had been released all at once, I would have binged it in a couple of days and only read boards after I was done. I would have likely never entertained the notion that Voq was Ash, because I would never have dug into IMDB or fan theories. I wouldn't have had enough time to think about who the Emperor might be or whether characters might be MU from the start or anything else.

I have loved waiting for each new episode, but my thirst for reading about the episodes and what people are saying has probably made the experience less good (or as least very different).

We will never know, I guess. I suppose the cynical answer to why it is weekly is so CBSAA can keep folks on the hook longer. For shows like House of Cards, I usually only get Netflix for the month it comes out, binge it and then cancel. I would have done the same with CBSAA, and I will most certainly drop it after the DSC season ends.
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Tue, Jan 16, 2018, 9:01am (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S6: Alice

It was ok until about 3/4 of the way through.

I can see why Alice wants a good pilot but:

1. What is Alice's motivation for suicide? It's never explained
2. Why does she need a pilot to kill herself? Surely once she's on course she wouldn't care whether Tom was beamed out or not
3. She mentioned needing a 'good pilot', the trader guy was 'too slow' to be of use to her. Nothing she did once she had a pilot explained why piloting skill mattered in the slightest. If all you're going to do is fly into an anomaly and die and idiot pilot could do that.

It all made no sense and it annoyed me that none of the characters even questioned the motivations of Alice flying into the anomaly.
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Tue, Dec 12, 2017, 1:32pm (UTC -6)
Re: TNG S1: Code of Honor

Just watching this again and I noticed something. Not weighing in on the racist/sexist discussion, my observation is far more important: At the start, why did they get beamed into the cargo bay instead of the transporter room??
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Mon, Dec 11, 2017, 12:15pm (UTC -6)
Re: TNG S1: The Naked Now

@Eduardo - I know I'm replying to a 10 year old comment but I don't think this is an error:

> "This line makes no sense. Data is working on a bridge acces panel. He should be UPLOADING data to sickbay, not the other way around."

If I connect my phone to my PC and instruct the PC to start streaming a movie, the PC is downloading the movie from netflix/youtube/whatever. The phone is just giving it the instruction "Go download this file". Depending on the ship's infrastructure, the data might have been downloaded from the central computer to the bridge but data then makes the same information available in medical.

Pedantic, yes, but in response to previous pedantry!
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Wed, Dec 6, 2017, 3:08am (UTC -6)
Re: ORV S1: Firestorm

Apologies if I repeat anything said already, as I only skimmed the comments because there are so many.

This is only the third (fourth?) Orville that I have seen. My uncle has been watching from the beginning, and I have seen several eps with him (such as the social media allegory one).

I was generally pleased with this one. Very much in the Trekkian fashion (yes, the Orville isnt Trek, but the similarities are a good way to view and analyze it). It reminded me of TNG's "Clues" or "Remember Me" and Voyager's "Latent Image," in that I spent most of the episode trying to unravel just what the hell was going on.

Unfortunately, despite being on the edge of my seat for 95% of the episode, it sort of falls flat once all the cards are on the table. Even as it became disappointing clearer what was going on, I was still eager for the exact how it was going on.

Problem #1: Once Penny Johnson shot the nurse, it was clear that one of two things was true. Either a) she was possessed or b) Alara was still in the holodeck or hallucinating or dreaming or some other reset button outcome.

Problem #2: Once Malloy was eaten, it was pretty much obviously option b. They were smart not to let Grayson not fall into that abyss earlier in the episode. Sure, they could have gone the losing folks one by one route, but that would have given any the hey-a-reset-button-is-coming much earlier, so I credit them with not doing an even poorer job of maintaining the fuller mystery.

Frankly, they just gave it away too early. Maybe Malloy should have been merely dragged off or injured and at least taken to sickbay (even if critically injured). Unfortunately, his being swallowed made it clear the reset button was coming.

The reveal that Alara was in fact in the holodeck still (and the others were watching) was interesting. However, the reveal that she locked herself into the program (despite being memory wiped at some point?), was not as palatable as had she been assigned to the program to retrain her or to deal with the grief or something. It just felt tacked onto what was otherwise an intriguing premise.

As for the humor, I laughed multiple times, and I felt this episode did not derail itself to squeeze in one-liners as much as the pilot or the other eps I saw (like the social media one).

One other thing: as I had not been keeping up with the show, Alara's freak out over the death of the guy at the beginning really threw me. Sure it was under her watch and she might feel responsible, but surely they have lost multiple people on the show (all the Trek shows lost crewmen (redshirts and unnamed mostly) at a pretty steady rate). I read after, however, that this was the first crew death for the ship. This also lends context to Mercer's struggling with the condelence letter (which also threw me). Of course, the Trek shows probably didn't show enough of (captains especially) grieving over causalities, save for the DS9 Dominion War stuff, and that was mostly only when the Feds were losing badly and war fatigue had set in.

So, all in all, the episode was worth a 3 out of 4. Not sure how watchable it is once the twist is known (though few twists eps of TV are ever the same after the initial viewing). I was really invested pretty much throughout.
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Mon, Nov 27, 2017, 6:44pm (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S4: The Raven

Why let continuity spoil a perfectly mediocre story?

We know seven left deep space 5 as a child and got assimilated at 6. How did the raven travel 60 thousand light years in a year?? Why don't the voyager crew ask this?
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Thu, Nov 23, 2017, 1:00pm (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S3: Before and After

Very good episode but I have a bone to pick with the producers.

If you're going to give Kes different wigs during the show to signify what time period she is in, don't choose this episode to change her hairstyle! At the end it wasn't clear whether we were seeing future Kes (relative to the previous/next episodes) or present day Kes. What stupid timing that was. I'd assumed the ending it was in the future because we hadn't seen kes with hair like that before and it would have taken a long time to grow it that long.

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Mon, Nov 13, 2017, 10:07am (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S3: Remember

> The Regressives are different because they don't like to use technology as much as the Enarans do, so in effect it's like Americans slaughtering Amish people or Mennonites. Why would we? I don't understand why the Enaran's want to kill all of the Regressives in the first place. Oh yeah, because they don't wash their hands. Seriously? What writer came up with that pathetic reason to slaughter an entire group of people? If they are that ultra-paranoid about sanitation, why not just do what they were pretending to do and move them to some isolated colony instead of killing all of them? The whole basis of this episode, to me, is idiotic.

But you could say the same thing about Nazi's killing Jews or Stalin have to target Jehovas Witnesses, Jews or most of the groups that went to the gulag? For the most part it was just a different heritage/way of life! Unfortunately it's not as unbelievable as it looks.
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Mon, Nov 13, 2017, 9:58am (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S3: False Profits

Honestly, I quite liked this episode.

The wormhole stuff was all a bit daft but the Ferengi on the planet worked for what it was until the "Grand Proxy" showed up.

I like that they managed to tie it in to the TNG episode and it does make sense that the ferengi would be viewed as gods of sorts. After all, they can make anything out of thin air. Though it does make me wonder: Can a replciator create gold? If so, why do the ferengi need the suspiciously human looking aliens to pay them anything?

Ignoring the replicator issue, the ferengi being greedy and wanting to be treated like gods does work and fit with the canon and with superior technology it's hardly surprising the bronze age civilisation saw them as superior beings.

The set up is fine but the episode goes down hill as soon as the "grand proxy" shows up. Even if we assume the doctor can make Neelix look like a ferengi, how did Neelix get up to speed on Frengi customs, traditions and philosophy so fast, given he's never even heard of a Ferengi until an hour before?

The ending is cliche. Of course the wormhole didn't work, it would have been better if they just used it to introduce the Ferengi/planet and kept it at "This end is unstable". Of course then they'd have to do something else with the Ferengi at the end.

Plot convenience aside, I did enjoy the episode and would give it 2/4. Not great but not terrible either.

And this goes for Star Trek in general. Can people not tell when a Universal Translator is in use? The Ferengi would expect the Grand Proxy to speak a Ferengi language, not Telaxian via translator. Any time I see a character pretending to be another race I wonder this.
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Fri, Nov 10, 2017, 10:10pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum


You questioned why Kol was on the Sarcophagus ship. Did he not steal it from Voq several episodes ago? After they got the Shenzou part...Where else has he been? Maybe I missed something.
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Thu, Nov 9, 2017, 6:12pm (UTC -6)
Re: VOY S3: The Swarm

What the hell, Janeway?

So they violate the prime directive by interfering. They had a warning and obviously understood it, chose to ignore it, tried to sneak through alien space without making sure the aliens knew they meant no harm and ended up killing dozens of people who probably thought they were protecting their home?

Think of it from the alien's perspective. They gave a warning, then they see voyager, a ship with advanced weaponry, sneaking past their defences heading deeper into their territory at high speed. They don't know if voyager is peaceful. Janeway made no attempt to make sure their message and intentions was clear and understood.

How would the federation react if they told a romulan warbird not to enter its space, then found it cloaked and heading at high speed into the middle of federation space?

Janeway is completely in the wrong here and committed a crime by killing those aliens who were defending their home.
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Tue, Nov 7, 2017, 2:30pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum

Re: Turler (Burner...whatever)

It is less that it is not believable or that it is forced. They just seem to have ZERO chemistry. It is not just solemn awkwardness (as a PTSD/former POW and a Vulcan-raised human). It has pseudo-relationship beats, but none of the pathos or feeling. I'd feel more if we saw them having a date, rather than blandly being a couple on an away mission (it's no "Change of Heart" for example).

At least with say Kira/Odo, you bought his feelings for her, and they had known each other for YEARS.
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Tue, Nov 7, 2017, 10:53am (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum

Interesting take from Ex Astris: "Tyler and Burnham are the perhaps most believable lovers in the history of Star Trek. The chemistry between them is wonderful; the romance doesn't feel contrived at all."

Unless he means it sarcastically (which he doesn't seem to imply elsewhere), it is a wonder he is watching the same show.
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Mon, Nov 6, 2017, 1:09pm (UTC -6)
Re: DSC S1: Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum

Despite enjoying it more than now, this was easily the least engaging episode for me so far.

Too much happening. Everything was rushed and truncated.


- Burnham is expecting prison after the war and sees Disco as a temporary assignment.

- Opening battle was very well done. Lorca tried so hard to save the other ship.

- L'Rell has some sort of plan (who knows what?). Classic House of Mokai.


- Burler (Tyham?) does nothing for me. I was afraid they were going to bang in the tent. Glad they didn't.

- Saru filled the all-too-common role of being influenced by the aliens of the week (but yes, they will be back it seems). The prey stuff with him is very weak to start, and this fit in with it, I guess, but it just isn't great characterization...yet.


- Stamets part did a lot in only a few minutes, but why didn't we see him "flying" the ship sooner? Will Tilly tell Burnham about Stamets' issues?
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