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Chrome
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 3:28pm (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S2: Threshold

@Robert

Sorry, I forgot they changed the scales, though Dave is right that they did pass warp 10 in TNG's "Where No One Has Gone Before". So either way, it's a continuity error. They could've fixed it by calling it something else besides warp 10, but I think they figured Voyager's viewers don't pay that much attention (or they totally forgot).
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Rahul
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 3:23pm (UTC -5)
Re: DS9 S5: By Inferno's Light

Felt like this episode spent a lot of time posturing with a rushed ending. Right off the bat we get Dukat's "defection" which creates the 2 teams: Dominion/Cardassia vs. Federation/Klingons etc.

It's pretty good episode overall but some things bothered me: Worf being able to defeat all those Jem'Hadar soldiers seems a bit of a stretch. And then just as he and the last Jem'Hadar leader are about to get shot, Garak's transporter (which is another stretch) works and they're beamed to the Runabout, which just happened to still be in orbit (i.e. the stupid Jem'Hadar didn't take control of it).

So Garak has to overcome his claustrophobia -- is this to make it seem like what he did is heroic? It was already borderline heroic but I don't think the writers needed to throw in the claustrophobia part -- just eats up time. The other part that eats up time is Worf's fighting and the whole Klingon honour thing.

Nice plan the Dominion/Cardassians set up with trying to supernova a sun. What I don't get is why a Changeling (Bashir) has to be the one sacrificed to do this. Aren't the Changelings revered as Gods by the Jem'Hadar? The Defiant going to warp and tractoring in the Runabout commandeered by Changeling Bashir also had no margin for error.

3 stars for "By Inferno's Light" -- the continuation of the main DS9 story arc has changing allegiances and resets the storylines; Dukat's a bad guy again and I like that. Another appearance from Gowron is always welcome -- lots of good elements here but the way it's all executed isn't the best with too much time spent on the wrong things.


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borusa
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 3:12pm (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S3: Deja Q

De Lancie brightens up any episode of TNG and Spiner worked very well with him.
I still don't like the Guinan / Q thing but at least we didn't have the daft hissing and posturing Skeksis impression nonsense that happened last time they clashed.
I loved the Mariachi band.
Q is just brilliant at lampooning the dull, self important twits of Starfleet.
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Peter G.
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 3:01pm (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S2: Threshold

Robert beat me to it. What's more interesting to me isn't that they changed the numbering system, but that in ST III Starfleet was on the brink of creating a functional transwarp system. I know this technobabble term probably meant nothing specific at the time, but in lieu of TNG having adopted the term for what the Borg use I find it funny to think that the Excelsior was using an experimental technology that would apparently prove to be too difficult to use but that the Borg already have. It would have made for a nice bit of continuity for someone to point out that the Borg had that fabled transwarp drive.

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NCC-1701-Z
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 2:45pm (UTC -5)
Re: DSC S1: General Discussion

"You know another series besides TOS that was really into long and literary episode titles? Andromeda."

I hope that's not a bad omen.
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Robert
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 2:38pm (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S2: Threshold

Also the warp scale has changed from TOS->TNG.

According to Star Trek: Starship Spotter, the redesignation of warp 10 as infinite speed occurred in 2312. The warp factor specifications prior to 2312 were rated by Starfleet using the Original Cochrane Unit warp scale, abbreviated as the OCU. Warp factors after 2312 use the Modified Cochrane Unit warp scale, abbreviated as the MCU.

Basically it used to go up closer to linearly and then they made warp 10 infinite speed and now it goes up exponentially as you approach warp 10.
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philosopher-animal
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 12:50pm (UTC -5)
Re: TOS S3: Let That Be Your Last Battlefield

There's also an anti-Vietnam war part to this, too:

"LOKAI: You have read about it in history, I see. How can I make your flesh know how it feels to see all those who are like you, and only because they are like you, despised, slaughtered, and even worse, denied the simplest bit of decency that is a living being's right? Do you know what it would be like to be dragged out of your hovel into a war on another planet? A battle that will serve your oppressor and bring death to you and your brothers? "
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Chrome
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 11:00am (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S2: Threshold

@Brian

Right, I'm sure Janeway was thrilled to share this experience with !LizardParis.

@Dave

No, it's a stupid continuity error. It's funny if you ever watch ST: III, because they're all matter-of-factly saying the record for warp speed is 14.1, with the possibility of the USS Excelsior breaking that record.
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Del_Duio
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 10:11am (UTC -5)
Re: ORV S1: Command Performance

Sorry guys, I didn't know the move was planned. Seemed odd that they'd only give it 2 weeks before bumping it someplace else but stranger things have happened.
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Peter G.
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 9:45am (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S2: Elogium

You tell 'em, Skuntle.
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Yanks
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 8:54am (UTC -5)
Re: ORV S1: Command Performance

SC,

I think this was done intentionally. The Orville benefited from the bump received by NFL watchers. Now that the fall TV schedule is starting, they will take their planned spot.
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Jammer
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 8:50am (UTC -5)
Re: ENT S1: Sleeping Dogs

I need to check the star rating on this with the original draft document, because the rating does not match the review at all. There might have been a data entry error at some point. Looks like someone pointed it out in 2011 and I missed it. Oops.
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Strejda
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 6:26am (UTC -5)
Re: ENT S1: Sleeping Dogs

The year is 2001 and after 35 years over numerous movies and TV shows, with their archetype being explored and played with not just in Star Trek but many other works of sci-fi, here is Star Trek's take on Klingons for the modern era: Dumb one-dimensional thugs who want to die in battle and say honor a lot.

Couple of cute character interactions, but otherwise, I found this one just kinda boring.
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Strejda
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 5:48am (UTC -5)
Re: ENT S1: Shadows of P'Jem

Sorry, one more thing: I know there is a lot of discussion over whether Vulcans on Enterprise were written well or not. An argument has been made that they acted like assholes a lot in previous shows and fans were just romanticizing them. Speaking as somebody who is fine with asshole Vulcans on DS9 and thinks the original concept for the Insane Admiral from Insurrection to be a Vulcan taking "needs of the many outweights the needs of the few" to its extreme, was a interesting and fresh idea wasted for the sake of mediocrity, I was mostly agreeing-until now.

Yes, some Vulcans have been shown to be xenophobic, arrogant dicks. But they have repeatedly been shown to be pacifists. Now obviously, pacifism is not a racial trait and no matter how big a part of their culture and philosophy it is, individuals will have different ideas over how far they should go. I recall that one of the reasons Sarek resented Spock for joining Starfleet, was that it means he was sometimes forced to kill as a part of his duty, for instance. But here, direct assault is shown to be their standard procedure, while our human heroes are the ones offended they would not negotiate (right after they discussed negotiations won't work but whatever).
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Chrome
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 5:37am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Best of Both Worlds, Part II

Worf would no doubt say something about honor, Data would mull over anti-android bias, and Shelby would request a transfer.
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Strejda
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 5:15am (UTC -5)
Re: ENT S1: Shadows of P'Jem

Well, I sure am glad they abandoned that stupid “both sides have a point” crap and just go straightforward Humans=good Vulcans=Bad now. And hey, the guys who beat the shit out of an unarmed prisoners, one which threatened to rape one are treated as a preferable choice.

Also, even if Tucker is right and the Vulcan guy doesn’t give a crap if T’Pol and Archer get killed (I do wonder how come he’s a dick for trying an assault, when it’s later said Tucker’s plan would achieve nothing anyway and only got lucky Shran was there), what exactly is refusing to give them information supposed to achieve, except to make it even more likely Archer and T’Pol will die? It’s not like they wouldn’t go through their assault without it. Trip is just being a spiteful moron.
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JohnTY
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 3:24am (UTC -5)
Re: TNG S4: The Best of Both Worlds, Part II

Sorry, so explain what would happen if he'd picked Worf as his first officer?
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Startrekwatcher
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 2:56am (UTC -5)
Re: DS9 S2: The Siege

3 stars

Nothing wrong with this episode. It's pretty entertaining --it's just that the first two episodes of this trilogy were so good and epic. This one felt a little smaller. That said I still enjoyed it--Sisko's speech in teaser, nog and Jake's good-bye, Quark's overselling seats, Dax and Kira trying to get the evidence to the Chamber of ministers, the series of action scenes aboard the station, Winn at the end when evidence provided being the first to want it examined, and seeing Kira's vision play out with Dax in religious garb and Winn's utterance of Blasphemy and the ministers calling to Kira
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SC
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 2:24am (UTC -5)
Re: ORV S1: Command Performance

Why do networks move shows around? And then they're surprised when the ratings fall. Not sure if it applies here, but taking the show off air for weeks (in between episodes) is bound to affect ratings too.
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Brian
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 1:40am (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S2: Threshold

I'm a lifelong Trek watcher. I enjoy all the highly rated episodes from all the shows, just like everyone else. Threshold was not the best episode but my god the criticism on this site is completely over the top. I enjoyed it. Paris did a good job with a weird script, and by the final scene with the amphibians, I was actually invested. This episode ended up being mostly about friendship and a shared experience between Paris and Janeway, and with the closing credits I was left simply with the feeling that they shared something nobody else would ever share, something they could always look back on and say "remember that insane thing that happened to us?" and just laugh. Kind of like kids who are best friends do years later. You all take yourselves way too seriously!
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Skuntle
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 12:52am (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S2: Elogium

The last episode showed what Voyager could be, and this episode shows what no show should be ever.

I don't even know where to begin tbh. There are so many horrible things in this episode. And I won't even mention all of it, because some of it has been explained by other posters already.

I guess I'll start with the 'coincidences'. Chakotay finds a couple making out, thus discussing reproducing with Janeway. Ok fine. Then Kes starts her reproductive cycle. Then they find out the alien beings are also trying to reproduce, and are in some mating ritual. Then Wildman shows up saying she is pregnant, which is, you know, reproducing. I could buy one of those in a show, or maybe even two, but all four? Come on.

And this is the episode that finally cements Neelix as the worst character in all of Star Trek. He is literally insanely jealous. Jealous of Paris saying 'I'll see you later'! Jealous of a doctor touching Kes's feet! His again insane behaviour in sickbay, when the Doc finally has to kick him out. Then of course the flesh and blood person being banned by a hologram comment to Janeway. And also the fact that he is now obviously a pedo instead of just a suspected one. Dating someone who hasn't even gone through puberty yet. Neelix is a terrible person and a terrible character, and I don't understand why someone so sweet and understanding as Kes would be with him in the first place. Or why anyone would have thought he was likeable in any way.

And wouldn't the doctor be able to figure out if they were genetically compatible enough to have a baby? I would think so, considering some of the medical miracles he's performed so far. But I can overlook that I suppose. Being unknown aliens and all, but it still bugged me a bit.

Chakotay says that the space sperm are moving around at 3000Km per second. That's 6 1/2 million miles an hour!! As if they could even see them. And when they are shown, they are moving around very slowly. Looks more like about 3 miles an hour to me. Also they absorb nutrients from space, because of their 'extremely porous outer covering'. We all know how many nutrients there are in space. Lots of course! And the best shell to have in the vacuum of space is an extremely porous one.

Later they say that Voyager is being pulled into the swarm of space sperm at 6,000Km per second. That's nearly 13 million miles an hour! How far away are they? And then to try and escape the swarm, they set their speed at 200Kph/120mph. lol. They will certainly escape a swarm of creatures that move at 6.5 million miles an hour by going 120 miles an hour.

They finally decide that they need to act 'submissive'. So they vent plasma to make it blue, and then flip the ship over. Here's the exact dialogue.

JANEWAY: Mister Paris, do we have enough power to take Voyager into a roll?
PARIS: I think so.
JANEWAY: All right. Let's give this a try. Mister Kim, start venting plasma residue. Mister Paris, roll the ship.
PARIS: Full power to inertial dampers.

Wut? That is probably the most ridiculous dialogue I've ever heard in Star Trek ever. They need full power to inertial dampers to flip the ship? They might not have enough power to flip the ship over? wut? This is outer space!! Not to mention the whole 3d nature of space, so who's to say what is upside down or not?

I won't even get into the more personal/social aspects of the show, but that is all totally ridiculous as well.

Worst episode so far.

Zero stars. Just awful. Worse than awful, in so many ways.
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Dave
Thu, Sep 21, 2017, 12:27am (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S2: Meld

Tuvok knows lots of Alpha Quadrant martial arts. I wonder if one of them is the lame Ambo-Jitzu from The Icarus Factor.
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Dave
Wed, Sep 20, 2017, 11:40pm (UTC -5)
Re: VOY S2: Threshold

Didn't the Enterprise go Warp 10 and then some in Where No One Has Gone Before, and perhaps in The Nth Degree too? Why didn't the Enterprise turn into salamanders then?
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Trek fan
Wed, Sep 20, 2017, 10:47pm (UTC -5)
Re: TOS S1: Miri

PS -- And I almost forgot to mention the most sumblime Shatner moment in the episode: His showdown with the "Lord of the Flies" gang at the end while they hold Rand hostage is a classic. It even gets scary when the kids start beating him, a rare shocking moment on Star Trek when you see Kirk's life is possibly in danger from a distressed group of children who have bruised and bloodied him. But Shatner is brilliant in this one, playing it straight, and his desperation escalates gradually in each scene of the story -- he progresses from amused to concerned, from irritable to despairing, and finally from desperate to heroic with great believability. It's probably one of the strongest Kirk character arcs of any episode in the series, when you think about it, because Shatner really gives you a sense of Kirk's helplessness in this one.
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Trek fan
Wed, Sep 20, 2017, 10:38pm (UTC -5)
Re: TOS S1: Miri

Star Trek does the zombie apocalypse in Miri, but ekes genuine warmth and drama out of it. Great episode that Leonard Nimoy once called a lovely and sensitive story, and I agree with him. It's also perhaps the first in a long line of "Kirk, McCoy, and Spock get stranded and must work together to survive" shows -- in this case with Yeoman Rand and two red shirts for company. I give it 3 1/2 or 4 stars.

Great guest stars here in Kim Darby (True Grit!) and Michael J. Pollard, who effect memorable characters. And I must say, rewatching these early episodes, that Grace Lee Whitney has real personality and chemistry as Yeoman Janice Rand -- she's very feminine but with a fiery personality that comes through when her eyes flash. She and Shatner play well off each other, continuing to keep their relationship on a professional level even at this point where it's clear that they both have feelings for each other, and I can see why Whitney was brough back for several cameos in the Star Trek movies after leaving the show prematurely in Season One.

The Spock-McCoy stuff is fun to watch, with McCoy's selfless humanism coming through in his willingness to test the "beaker of death" (love that Spock line) on himself and Spock's dry humorous-yet-reverential comment (McCoy has clearly earned his respect, almost against his own better judgment) later about "the medical mind." In this case, Kirk kind of stays in the middle while they fight things out, and it's fun stuff. Spock's line "and I *do* want to return to the ship" is also a great one in a particularly well-written script.

No Sulu, Scotty, or Uhura in this one, unfortunately, but we hardly notice since it's a McCoy-Spock-Kirk show. Side note: While it's true the women characters on TOS often serve food and coffee, as Rand does in her capacity as yeoman, it's also noteworthy here that Uhura's assistant/backup comm officer is a white man -- it's not strictly a "woman's job" to run the communications system. Little touches like this one remind us how TOS often subverted gender and racial divisions right under the noses of censors -- and why some families refused to watch the show in the 1960s because of its racial and gender integration.

But above all else, the story to "Miri" is an endlessly fascinating classic Sci-Fi yarn, inviting us to consider the moral implications of pushing science beyond moral limits for the sake of human vanity -- the idea here is to that people of present-day Earth (circa the episode's air date) accidentally wiped out the whole planet's population while pursuing a medical means of prolonging life indefinitely. Far from creating the Zombie apocalypse through a nuclear war, the people of this alternate earth created it through self-improvement medicine, and it's really clever how the disease partially succeeded by elongating the life of children until they reach puberty and are hyper-accelerated into a zombielike adulthood that kills them.

So there's kind of a space allegory about puberty here, too, playing on adolescent fears that adulthood will kill us because we're not ready for it. And the traumatized "elderly children" (love Kirk's "never date older women" quip to Rand at the end regarding Miri's crush) are clearly terrified and in distress, leading them to attack Kirk out of fear and confusion. All of this stuff, including Miri's girlish crush on Kirk and Kirk's efforts to earn her trust for the sake of the landing party, is astonishingly well-observed in human terms. There's even some real emotion in the Kirk-Rand scene, and in the escalating conflicts among the landing party when the disease wears them down, as things gradually start looking desperate. Very nice to see a real sense of danger on Star Trek, a hallmark of TOS.

As for the alleged plot holes, I really have to say with all due respect -- as a lifelong Star Trek fan who has seen every episode and movie of every series -- that I think we fans really start to lose the point when we insist on a line of dialogue to explain away every little uncertainty or unresolved thread in an episode. The point of TOS is to provide an abstract allegory, to raise more questions than it answers in order to make viewers think, and it's far more nourishing to the imagination to leave certain details (like what did the kids eat to survive?) unexplained rather than invent a technobabble solution -- see TNG, Voyager, and Enterprise for over-explanations if you're more concerned to harmonize the fictional universe of this franchise into a coherent self-contained bubble than to think about the big issues it raises. Watch TOS if you're more concerned to wrestle with big questions as you get to know a very warm and lovable cast of characters -- questions like how to care for traumatized children while working harmoniously with different personalities to save yourselves from the Zombie apocalypse that killed them and fend off a girl's first crush. And questions like whether there are any moral limits to risky procedures to prolong life, beauty, and other passing things which make us who we are as human beings.
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